Jobe Watson - not good

[James_Pies]

I agree he should be stripped from his brownlow and essendon need to be punished in some sort of way.

[tor01doc]

I keep hearing that it isn't actually on the banned list. It's just not on the approved list which by some is considered the same thing.

If it's not approved, it is banned.

Seems more of a violation to me if something is actually written down in black and white as banned as opposed to something that isn't.

[pikla]

Not a Jobe owner but wouldn't be worried if I was. Jobe clearly isn't silly, I don't think he would have made those comments unless he knew he was in the clear

[tor01doc]

That does make sense.

I suspect more than one club was into the non banned but non approved gear.

Should we suggest a hefty fine and a few draft picks as penalty?

50% of the fine to m0nty!  ;D

[Typhnn]

My understanding of the whole "AOD-9604 substance", was that it wasn't actually banned but a chemical/ingredient, which is contained within the AOD-9604 is actually banned...

And as said previously, I'm sure Jobe/Bombers wouldn't have said the comments without knowing the possible outcome of talking about the whole drug issue...

[Noz]

Give the brownlow to Mitch and that spud from Richmond although i doubt neither of them would want to win it like.

If it happened to a club interstate the AFL would want their heads on plates and start handing out hefty fines and start sacking some players.

If Jobe Watson wasnt a Watson, Jobe woulld not be playing again this year.

[fever]

If it happened to a club interstate the AFL would want their heads on plates and start handing out hefty fines and start sacking some players.

do people outside of victoria actually believe this is true? that there's some kind of persecution mentality, implied or otherwise? utter, utter nonsense. the governence of the league is by the same body that elected to disband the VFL back in the 80s, surely their vested interest would be to- if anything- favour the interstate clubs to ensure the success of their decision. realisticly there is no bias though, which is the way it should be.

[disco1992]

I just think the afl drug policy is weak whether its recreational/performance enhancing.
1. Recreational - 3 strikes + you don't get a strike if you ask to be tested!
2. In  most other workplaces if you are caught with drugs in your system you are likely to be terminated
3. If the afl used cycling's policies, Jobe would be stripped of his brownlow, essondon would lose their points and Jobe would get a ban from the afl (a bit harsh glad it's not that strict because he is a star)
4. The people who administered the drugs must have known it was a banned WADA substance! If not use google it's not hard to find the info!
5. Yes the drug wasn't banned by ASADA at the time but it was banned by WADA so it must have been known it wasn't above board!
6. Does anyone remember when Shane Warne took a banned substance! Stood down from competing for 12 months!!

All in all, I love watching Jobe play and think he is a star but i really want to know, how are the afl taking the use of a banned drug (WADA) so casually.

[disco1992]

If it happened to a club interstate the AFL would want their heads on plates and start handing out hefty fines and start sacking some players.

do people outside of victoria actually believe this is true? that there's some kind of persecution mentality, implied or otherwise? utter, utter nonsense. the governence of the league is by the same body that elected to disband the VFL back in the 80s, surely their vested interest would be to- if anything- favour the interstate clubs to ensure the success of their decision. realisticly there is no bias though, which is the way it should be.

What's worse tanking or breaching a salary cap?
I think tanking because it ruins the integrity of the sport! And Melbourne only lost money, no draft picks to correct the extras they got!
Where adelaide breached salary and got fined Picks, doesn't make sense! In saying that afl is weak compared to NRL where the storm got the book thrown at them!

[GCSkiwi]

I talked a bit about this a while ago in the Bombers forum, I'll make a quick summary post here:

AOD-9604 - What does it do? It's unclear if it upregulates natural growth hormone, or acts as it's own compound with the same effect. Either way, it provides a boost to fat metabolism, helping shed extra kilo's compared to exercising alone. It has a secondary effect of being anabolic (meaning it helps build muscle) but this is a more minor effect and definitely wouldn't be the primary use for it. That being said, it's not called "growth" hormone for no reason. However, given the name (AOD = Advanced Obesity Drug), the research has primarily been conducted in overweight people, so there's every chance it would actually do nothing in athletes (speculation on my behalf).

Is it legal? Almost certainly not, given that WADA have a policy that any drug or supplement not yet cleared through clinical trials is deemed unsafe and thus banned. They have a nice big blanket clause for that one. The actual banned list is reserved for compounds that have been trialled and accepted for use, 99.9% of the time for therapeutic reasons, but open to abuse by athletes. These compounds could give them an unfair competitive advantage, and thus WADA bans them.

As a general rule, if the supplement on it's own can make you harder, fitter, faster or stronger (thanks daft punk), it will be banned. If it's a supplement that helps you train harder but the improvements are still entirely contingent on your training, generally it will be ok. Then certain sports have sub categories for banned things - like alcohol - illegal in accuracy type sports because it can stop nerve tremors, making you more accurate (like archery or darts). But if you choose to go get drunk then run a marathon, you're an idiot and it provides no advantage, so not banned.

End effect: I think nothing will happen to the bombers to be honest. It would be a big commercial problem - no doubt there will be policy changes and some heads will roll but I think it woon't be players themselves, more likely the high performance staff (which have already been culled). There are a few technicalities and get out of jail free cards but by absolute strictest interpretations, anyone who took AOD-9604 could get a lengthy stint on the sidelines. I just don't think the rules will be interpreted in their absolute form given the situation.

[disco1992]

Also what do people think is worse for afl taking drugs or getting extra money?
Jobe Watson took drugs- ATM no punishment
Kurt Tippett got some extra cash- 12 week suspension!

[fever]

If it happened to a club interstate the AFL would want their heads on plates and start handing out hefty fines and start sacking some players.

do people outside of victoria actually believe this is true? that there's some kind of persecution mentality, implied or otherwise? utter, utter nonsense. the governence of the league is by the same body that elected to disband the VFL back in the 80s, surely their vested interest would be to- if anything- favour the interstate clubs to ensure the success of their decision. realisticly there is no bias though, which is the way it should be.

What's worse tanking or breaching a salary cap?
I think tanking because it ruins the integrity of the sport! And Melbourne only lost money, no draft picks to correct the extras they got!
Where adelaide breached salary and got fined Picks, doesn't make sense! In saying that afl is weak compared to NRL where the storm got the book thrown at them!

couple of things to note here. firstly, and while only technical it is still important, melbourne weren't found guilty of tanking. they were fined for the actions of Chris Connoly and Dean bailey in discussing the merits of not giving their team the best chance to win. Whilst everyone else with a brain would call that tanking the afl were careful to not go down that path due to the legal can of worms they would open themselves up to if they did.

secondly, the afl were the ones that dangled the carrot of the compensation pick as incentive for teams to underperform/lose. it would be massively unfair to thump someone for taking advantage of a gaping loophole that you yourself had left open.

re adelaide, i would argue that the club got an appropriate penalty for blatantly and flagrantly breaking the rules, as opposed to melbourne who weren't even found to have broken any rules, and that steven trigg got off with such a light slap on the wrist as to almost be laughable.

[Ricochet]

Travis Casserly takes two cold and flu tablets Sudafed = 2 year ban
Wade Lees only imports banned steroid = 1.5 year ban (ASADA pushed for 2 years)
Kane Goodwin done for Cocaine and an anabolic steroid = 2 year ban
Dean Cadwallader done for anabolic steroid = 2 year ban
Jobe Watson takes AOD 9604 = ??

He is a champion and I really really really want him to get off but i just dunno what will happen here. ASADA don't take prisoners

[GCSkiwi]

Travis Casserly takes two cold and flu tablets Sudafed = 2 year ban
Wade Lees only imports banned steroid = 1.5 year ban (ASADA pushed for 2 years)
Kane Goodwin done for Cocaine and an anabolic steroid = 2 year ban
Dean Cadwallader done for anabolic steroid = 2 year ban
Jobe Watson takes AOD 9604 = ??

He is a champion and I really really really want him to get off but i just dunno what will happen here. ASADA don't take prisoners

Fair points Ricochet, I guess the thing to consider is intent - I don't know about Casserly, sounds like there has to be more to it than just that... But the others - if they're importing/using anabolic steroids, there is intent there. I genuinely believe that the bombers were likely duped into thinking AOD-9604 was either not banned or were given incorrect accounts of the effects of it. Don't get me wrong, there are a lot of red flags - "we want to inject you with stuff" - number 1. But equally I believe it is unfair to expect that athletes must train to be competitive but are still held responsible for what they take - they simply don't have the time or education to be able to make well-informed decisions about nutrition/supplements/ergogenic aids. I think there has to be a point at which the players themselves are not liable, if I'm a medical/high performance staff member, who comes at you with an injection saying "take this, it's totally legal and will help you fight off colds", you really have no way of knowing if I'm right. It could be cyanide, or it could be saline. I wouldn't expect an athlete to tell the difference - that's the reason the staff are there.

Slam the club, absolutely. Strip them of points, draft picks, and yes probably take Jobe's brownlow off him. But I don't think player bans are warranted, there's a difference...

[Ricochet]

Travis Casserly takes two cold and flu tablets Sudafed = 2 year ban
Wade Lees only imports banned steroid = 1.5 year ban (ASADA pushed for 2 years)
Kane Goodwin done for Cocaine and an anabolic steroid = 2 year ban
Dean Cadwallader done for anabolic steroid = 2 year ban
Jobe Watson takes AOD 9604 = ??

He is a champion and I really really really want him to get off but i just dunno what will happen here. ASADA don't take prisoners

Fair points Ricochet, I guess the thing to consider is intent - I don't know about Casserly, sounds like there has to be more to it than just that... But the others - if they're importing/using anabolic steroids, there is intent there. I genuinely believe that the bombers were likely duped into thinking AOD-9604 was either not banned or were given incorrect accounts of the effects of it. Don't get me wrong, there are a lot of red flags - "we want to inject you with stuff" - number 1. But equally I believe it is unfair to expect that athletes must train to be competitive but are still held responsible for what they take - they simply don't have the time or education to be able to make well-informed decisions about nutrition/supplements/ergogenic aids. I think there has to be a point at which the players themselves are not liable, if I'm a medical/high performance staff member, who comes at you with an injection saying "take this, it's totally legal and will help you fight off colds", you really have no way of knowing if I'm right. It could be cyanide, or it could be saline. I wouldn't expect an athlete to tell the difference - that's the reason the staff are there.

Slam the club, absolutely. Strip them of points, draft picks, and yes probably take Jobe's brownlow off him. But I don't think player bans are warranted, there's a difference...

Yep completely agree that the Club should cop the most of this. Just pointing out that ASADA only deal with black and white, there isn't a grey area.
On Casserly it was reported he took Sudafed for ongoing Hay Fever issues, but it does give you a kick like say Nodoz will