DT v SC

[Master Q]

Lets prove which one is better. Vote.

[ossie85]

One of these not long ago

http://www.fanfooty.com.au/forum/index.php/topic,7206.0.html

Also, this doesn't prove which is better, it proves which is more popular (cask wine is more popular than $100,000 bottles of wine...)

[Justin Bieber]

depends on what's your poison.

[Prospector_1]

Interesting to note that DT rate my team use polls much more often than SC.

If you want at least the minimum in a rate, you really should poll!

[ossie85]

11-all so far, it is neck and neck!

[MissPies]

It is hard to compare the DT to SC.
DT award points based on a kick, tackles etc even if they are ineffective ..where as SC do not award points on any misgivings.

[ossie85]

Good to see SC getting a healthy lead now.

[Alex7089]

Nice SC out to a 6 vote lead now, carn boys you know SC is better :P

[DALGER]

I hate the fact that players get rewarded for sprays and turnovers in DT, supercoach really highlights the game breakers and the 1pecenters! SC is the Aussie way!

[MissPies]

In answer to your question, It is not a matter of which one is better. Ok so we know DT gives points for anything as long as its touched lol, SC do not even post the entire scoring system due to the fact it depends on the player the game the situation blah blah blah.BUT having said that SC give alot more zeros and minuses on their scoring system so imo it pretty much works out the same give or take.

Either way who the hell cares! its footy we love it...GAME ON!

[Bomber Rock]

I much prefer DT over SC. When playing a numbers game, I prefer it to be black and white. I don't like some nerdy statistician deciding on what is an effective kick and what is not. In DT a kick is a kick, and that's the way it should be.

[ossie85]

That's fair, if you think a Jordan McMahon kick backwards to an opponent should be worth the same as an Alan Didak 50m chest pass to someone in the goal square, than so be it.

I don't understand though, unless you're counting every stat of every game as they come up LIVE - i.e. what a nerdy statistician would do - than what does it matter if each kick is worth the same or not?

[Justin Bieber]

sc leading 22 - 17.

don't mind either but am way better at supercoach than dt.

[Bomber Rock]

That's fair, if you think a Jordan McMahon kick backwards to an opponent should be worth the same as an Alan Didak 50m chest pass to someone in the goal square, than so be it.

I don't understand though, unless you're counting every stat of every game as they come up LIVE - i.e. what a nerdy statistician would do - than what does it matter if each kick is worth the same or not?

What if McMahon's backwards kick opens up free players on the other wing, enabling the Tigers get to the other end of the ground and have a shot on goal, does that change the value or worth of a kick?

What if by hitting cloke on the chest 45 out on the boundary (typical of Collingwood's along the boundary game style - and that is not me criticising) the opportunity to handpass to a running lockyer was missed, who would have then delivered to Anthony 40 out on a much better angle? I know i would rather Anthony having a shot than Cloke, no matter where the kick is from!

I know this is all hypothetical, but which kick is better then? In my view the average looking kick by Mc Mahon is of more value. Im not sure if this is the best example, but im sure you undertand what i am getting at.

Look I understand SC rewards better players, but we are not coaching actual players here, this is simply a numbers game and I just prefer my numbers games to be more black and white - but for the record I can appreciate people preferring SC!!

[ossie85]

What if McMahon's backwards kick opens up free players on the other wing, enabling the Tigers get to the other end of the ground and have a shot on goal, does that change the value or worth of a kick?

I said 'kick to the opposition', in the case you describe there, it would be an 'effective' kick and scored more highly. So yes, of course that would make the kick worth more than other kicks. Which is what supercoach does! Dream Team doesn't care about that.

What if by hitting cloke on the chest 45 out on the boundary (typical of Collingwood's along the boundary game style - and that is not me criticising) the opportunity to handpass to a running lockyer was missed, who would have then delivered to Anthony 40 out on a much better angle? I know i would rather Anthony having a shot than Cloke, no matter where the kick is from!

If Cloke gets the goal, it will be considered a 'goal assist' for Didak (I'm fairly sure), if he misses it will count less. Again, supercoach counts for this, Dream Team doesn't. If Cloke misses, it will be an ineffective kick, if Anthony gets it will count as an effective kick. Dream Team counts them the same, Supercoach doesn't.

I understand the point you are getting at, but Supercoach rewards quality, and punishes mistakes. It still has it flaws, for instance it still fails to value Scarlett, Lake, Glass, Rutten and Presti correctly, but it does a damn well better job than Dream Team.

I know this is all hypothetical, but which kick is better then? In my view the average looking kick by Mc Mahon is of more value. Im not sure if this is the best example, but im sure you undertand what i am getting at.

You're right, the Didak handball to Lockyer who kicks to Anthony who goals is worth more than a Didak kick to Cloke who misses.

Dream Team:
Didak handball to Lockyer (2 points), Lockyer kicks to Anthony (3 points), Anthony marks (3 points), Anthony Kicks and goals (3 and 6 points) = 17 points
Didak kicks to Cloke (3 points), Cloke marks, kicks and misses (3, 3 and 1 points) = 10 points

Supercoach (some scaling would be involved for the 3300 rule, but roughly and assuming both marks are contested)
Didak handball to Lockyer (2 points for Didak, 1 to Lockyer), Lockyer kicks to Anthony (4 points Lockyer), Anthony marks (6 points), Anthony Kicks and goals (4 and 8 points) = 25 points
Didak kicks to Cloke (4 points), Cloke marks, kicks and misses (6, 0 and 1 points) = 11 points

In that example, Supercoach does a better job of scoring than Dream Team surely.

Edit - slight math error

Look I understand SC rewards better players, but we are not coaching actual players here, this is simply a numbers game and I just prefer my numbers games to be more black and white - but for the record I can appreciate people preferring SC!!

That's fair! And I can understand that people like to follow the game on TV and think 'hey, a kick! That's 3 points for me and not think about it anymore'. I just like stats to better reflect the game, otherwise they are useless