NBA Season 2017/18

[Holz]

Has anyone seen the uncut footage of what happens after what JR did in game 1?

Goes for around 2 minutes and one of the most embarrassing things I’ve ever seen. I’d be ashamed if I was LeBron especially and some of the other team members. Just ridiculous that happen considering the game was continuing and at that stage still a decent chance to win

Yeah watched it last night, LeBron looked like he could've cried, reckon he is just playing now to keep his stats up and has checked out on the rest of the team.  Deservedly so in my opinion.

totally agree if he walks away from this series putting up 35 10 10 even if its a 4 game sweep you cant critisize him (people will but realistically its going to do nothing to tarnish him).

if he puts up 15 points then people will call it a meltdown.

[jvalles69]

Has anyone seen the uncut footage of what happens after what JR did in game 1?

Goes for around 2 minutes and one of the most embarrassing things I’ve ever seen. I’d be ashamed if I was LeBron especially and some of the other team members. Just ridiculous that happen considering the game was continuing and at that stage still a decent chance to win

Yeah watched it last night, LeBron looked like he could've cried, reckon he is just playing now to keep his stats up and has checked out on the rest of the team.  Deservedly so in my opinion.

totally agree if he walks away from this series putting up 35 10 10 even if its a 4 game sweep you cant critisize him (people will but realistically its going to do nothing to tarnish him).

if he puts up 15 points then people will call it a meltdown.

I think this is the time where everyone (excluding Bron haters) know this won't be his fault, how terrible Cavs are, and how great a team he's playing is.

When was the last time 1 man took town a team of superstars?  Dirk beat LeBron, Wade and Bosh.  Dirk GOAT.  ;D

[Holz]

Has anyone seen the uncut footage of what happens after what JR did in game 1?

Goes for around 2 minutes and one of the most embarrassing things I’ve ever seen. I’d be ashamed if I was LeBron especially and some of the other team members. Just ridiculous that happen considering the game was continuing and at that stage still a decent chance to win

Yeah watched it last night, LeBron looked like he could've cried, reckon he is just playing now to keep his stats up and has checked out on the rest of the team.  Deservedly so in my opinion.

totally agree if he walks away from this series putting up 35 10 10 even if its a 4 game sweep you cant critisize him (people will but realistically its going to do nothing to tarnish him).

if he puts up 15 points then people will call it a meltdown.

I think this is the time where everyone (excluding Bron haters) know this won't be his fault, how terrible Cavs are, and how great a team he's playing is.

When was the last time 1 man took town a team of superstars?  Dirk beat LeBron, Wade and Bosh.  Dirk GOAT.  ;D

doesnt matter as soon as he loses we will be hearing about how Lebron has as many finals losses as Jordan has finals wins.

2011 heat arent even close to 18 warriors and id actually say the 11 mavs are better then the 18 cavs

got to remember the mavs swept a 32 year old kobe + 30 year old pau when Kobe was 1st team all nba and Pau second team all nba.

then 4-1 against a young KD Westbrook Harden Ibaka. Where KD was 1st team all nba and Westbrook 2nd team all nba.

[Jay]

2011 Mavs destroy these Cavs and it's not close at all. Cavs went to G7 vs a team with a guy who's just turned 20 as their best player. And got pushed to 7 in the first round too.

I think the '11 Mavs actually go a bit underrated. The run they went on that post-season is incredible

[plumdog millionaire]

2011 Mavs destroy these Cavs and it's not close at all. Cavs went to G7 vs a team with a guy who's just turned 20 as their best player. And got pushed to 7 in the first round too.

I think the '11 Mavs actually go a bit underrated. The run they went on that post-season is incredible

Surely not going to do Horford dirty like that

[Holz]

Mavs where also a lethal 3 point shooting team that hit their shots

[jvalles69]

Not taking anything away from the Mavs, but 2011 and 2014 finals are glaring blemishes on Lebrons' career regardless of how you want to spin it.

[Holz]

Not taking anything away from the Mavs, but 2011 and 2014 finals are glaring blemishes on Lebrons' career regardless of how you want to spin it.

certainly dont disagree with you on 2011, he chocked hard he certainly had the better team.

2014 i completely disagree he was at worst decent with 28 points on 57% shooting with 52% from 3.

Wade and Bosh where both very poor. Together they put up 29 9 4 which is basically what lebron did solo.

[jvalles69]

Not taking anything away from the Mavs, but 2011 and 2014 finals are glaring blemishes on Lebrons' career regardless of how you want to spin it.

certainly dont disagree with you on 2011, he chocked hard he certainly had the better team.

2014 i completely disagree he was at worst decent with 28 points on 57% shooting with 52% from 3.

Wade and Bosh where both very poor. Together they put up 29 9 4 which is basically what lebron did solo.

He's still meant to be the best player on the planet with a decent supporting cast, best players on the planet don't go down 4-1 to an ageing Spurs, albeit who were absolutely rampaging at the time.

[Holz]

Not taking anything away from the Mavs, but 2011 and 2014 finals are glaring blemishes on Lebrons' career regardless of how you want to spin it.

certainly dont disagree with you on 2011, he chocked hard he certainly had the better team.

2014 i completely disagree he was at worst decent with 28 points on 57% shooting with 52% from 3.

Wade and Bosh where both very poor. Together they put up 29 9 4 which is basically what lebron did solo.

He's still meant to be the best player on the planet with a decent supporting cast, best players on the planet don't go down 4-1 to an ageing Spurs, albeit who were absolutely rampaging at the time.

The old spurs duncan ginobli dropped 30 13 6 so outplayed wade bosh.

Then rest of the heat was old even compared spurs e.g. green mills

Then you had a 2nd team all nba parker and a young up and coming star in kawhi who dropped 18 each

Then add in pop

No embarassment in that loss.

2011 was embarassing even though mavs are underatted and went on a giant killing run

[jvalles69]

Not taking anything away from the Mavs, but 2011 and 2014 finals are glaring blemishes on Lebrons' career regardless of how you want to spin it.

certainly dont disagree with you on 2011, he chocked hard he certainly had the better team.

2014 i completely disagree he was at worst decent with 28 points on 57% shooting with 52% from 3.

Wade and Bosh where both very poor. Together they put up 29 9 4 which is basically what lebron did solo.

He's still meant to be the best player on the planet with a decent supporting cast, best players on the planet don't go down 4-1 to an ageing Spurs, albeit who were absolutely rampaging at the time.

The old spurs duncan ginobli dropped 30 13 6 so outplayed wade bosh.

Then rest of the heat was old even compared spurs e.g. green mills

Then you had a 2nd team all nba parker and a young up and coming star in kawhi who dropped 18 each

Then add in pop

No embarassment in that loss.

2011 was embarassing even though mavs are underatted and went on a giant killing run

You don't need to defend LeBron with me, he is incredible, I'm just saying he has blemishes unlike MJ, and I'm not counting Washington because that was NOT MJ.  You can say he lost finals early in his career, but he hadn't claimed the title of best player in the league yet, Magic and Bird plus the Pistons helped him reach that level and once he won, he didn't lose again.  MJ also went up against a conference that was incredibly tough when the West was weak, on the other hand LeBron has seen the weakest incarnation of the eastern conference in my memory spanning over a decade.

[Holz]

No player has no blemishes, Jordan just has no blemishes in the finals he has plenty of blemishes in the playoff before reaching the finals.

The guy was the best player in the league by 98.

1998: Got knocked out in the second round to a team that lost in the finals after pumping out 35 6 6 to win the MVP only dropped 27 points which is 8 worse then in the regular season.

1989: Got Knocked out in the ECF to a team that did sweep the finals, Jordan was very good but he still lost.

1990: Again lost in the ECF to a team that won the NBA finals, again Jordan was very good but he still lost.

1995 happend: The bulls lost to the Magic who got swept in the finals. Was he rusty yeah a little bit, but was he fresh after taking two years off yes aswell.



All that is different is Jordan's blemishes are before he made the finals and Lebron's is in the finals.

If Jordan was say in the West and made all the above Finals and his record was 6-4 than that surely should help his legacy, but weirdly it would hurt it as for some reason losing in the second round is better then losing in the finals.

6-4 is far greater then 6-0 but it ruins this myth of no blemishes.

Do you you know what no blemishes looks like.

If Jordan went 15-0 in seasons then thats no blemishes. He only made the finals 40% of the years he was in the NBA, Lebron is sitting at 60%.


Most Finals Played (By Greats):

Bill Russell   12
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar   10
Magic Johnson   9
LeBron James   9 and counting
Kobe Bryant   7
Wilt Chamberlain   6
Tim Duncan   6
Shaquille O'Neal   6
Michael Jordan   6
Larry Bird   5
Kevin Durant   3 and counting

I have never said Jordan isnt great, he just isnt head and shoulders above the rest. The list above shows that.

Even in Finals Won he doesnt stand out alone

Most Finals Won (By Greats):

Bill Russell   11
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar   6
Michael Jordan   6
Magic Johnson   5
Tim Duncan   5
Shaquille O'Neal   4
LeBron James   3 and counting
Kevin Durant   2 and counting

[jvalles69]

This argument has no end, and honestly I don't think they should be compared anyway.  Listened to a little bit of an excerpt from Gary Payton weighing in on the topic which was cool to hear.  To me anyway, it all comes down to being the best player on the planet at the time.  MJ with 6 finals and 6 FMVP = greatest player on the planet.  Don't think they had MVP awards around Russell's era so hard to tell where he fits in and that was before my time re the "eye test".  Best interpretation I've heard that I can lean towards is that MJ is the greatest basketball player and LeBron is the best basketball player, and he still has a chance to take both titles.

[R.Griffen]

Why can’t we just all agree Steph is the best player to play at any time. How many other players won the regular season MVP unanimously

[jvalles69]

Why can’t we just all agree Steph is the best player to play at any time. How many other players won the regular season MVP unanimously

Steph shines KD's boots...