Rule Change Discussion for 2015/16

[Pkbaldy]

Kick Ineffective:

All Behinds
high-risk kicks as well as the amount of off-target kicks that aren't necessarily turnovers or clangers. Doesn't matter about pressure on the situation.

Kick Clanger:

All out on the full besides kicks off the ground
The outcome of a kick clanger is that the opposition ends up with possession eg: direct turnover to opposition player, out on the full.

PK see above. It is surely too harsh to penalise players for behinds and would rather wait for clangers or not have minus for ineffective kicks for sure.

R50s is a very bad idea. I have looked how included that will affect the scoring of ALL players in the AFL and it is detrimental to what you're trying to achieve and does not make big defenders more relevant. All it does is make the Heath Shaws, Hodges and mids like Ebert much more overpowered.

Do you know who the top 10 for spoils are?? Just wondering.

Yes. I have all stats of all players in the AFL.

You can also find it yourself if you search AFL tables in google and find the spoils column little fella

Yeah im not that curious kiddo.

[Spite]

I'm not quite sure why you're acting like that PK. Obviously you're being condescending, which is fine if you're going to be telling me something useful while being condescending, but calling me little fella when I'm statistically likely to be taller than you and also kiddo, when I'm older than you, is just strange. Maybe that is normal social behaviour for you and if so, then I apologise, I was unaware you usually conduct yourself in that manner. You asked a question and I told you where you could find the answer for it, if you weren't curious then why did you ask the question?
If you aren't willing to look up spoils, then please do not bother suggesting points per spoil as you will not have any idea how that causes an effect on the scoring system as a whole. This was very clear when you suggested points for R50s. It would be nice if people offered educated suggestions and not just blurting out random numbers for random stats, with well researched justifications as to why they have made those choices.

[Pkbaldy]

I'm not quite sure why you're acting like that PK. Obviously you're being condescending, which is fine if you're going to be telling me something useful while being condescending, but calling me little fella when I'm statistically likely to be taller than you and also kiddo, when I'm older than you, is just strange. Maybe that is normal social behaviour for you and if so, then I apologise, I was unaware you usually conduct yourself in that manner. You asked a question and I told you where you could find the answer for it, if you weren't curious then why did you ask the question?
If you aren't willing to look up spoils, then please do not bother suggesting points per spoil as you will not have any idea how that causes an effect on the scoring system as a whole. This was very clear when you suggested points for R50s. It would be nice if people offered educated suggestions and not just blurting out random numbers for random stats, with well researched justifications as to why they have made those choices.

Hahahahahahaha! No idea why you're being such a girl. I couldn't really care less if you were taller and older than me.

I simply just asked for the top 10 spoiling players (Hoping i'd get averages per game) because the internet connection at work is horrendous when visiting a lot of sites.  But instead you decided to be a complete dick about it.

[Pkbaldy]

Found it!! Thanks Spite and Google.

[Spite]

I'm not quite sure why you're acting like that PK. Obviously you're being condescending, which is fine if you're going to be telling me something useful while being condescending, but calling me little fella when I'm statistically likely to be taller than you and also kiddo, when I'm older than you, is just strange. Maybe that is normal social behaviour for you and if so, then I apologise, I was unaware you usually conduct yourself in that manner. You asked a question and I told you where you could find the answer for it, if you weren't curious then why did you ask the question?
If you aren't willing to look up spoils, then please do not bother suggesting points per spoil as you will not have any idea how that causes an effect on the scoring system as a whole. This was very clear when you suggested points for R50s. It would be nice if people offered educated suggestions and not just blurting out random numbers for random stats, with well researched justifications as to why they have made those choices.

Hahahahahahaha! No idea why you're being such a girl. I couldn't really care less if you were taller and older than me.

I simply just asked for the top 10 spoiling players (Hoping i'd get averages per game) because the internet connection at work is horrendous when visiting a lot of sites.  But instead you decided to be a complete dick about it.

What's wrong with being a girl?

Why don't you get off fanfooty then and search for the spoils averages yourself if tabs are a problem? I wasn't being a dick about it, I told you how to search for it so you could do it yourself because I am busy and wanted you to be able to still get the information if you didn't know how to do it.

[Ringo]

Hey guys just settle down a little.  We only need to discuss the pros and cons of changes in UF and not start personal attacks on each other, I am really tempted to delete the banter between you 2 as it has nothing to do with what we are discussing here. Started of OK but deteriorated.

[elephants]

As a British XVs coach, I agree with Ringo.

[Spite]

Hey guys just settle down a little.  We only need to discuss the pros and cons of changes in UF and not start personal attacks on each other, I am really tempted to delete the banter between you 2 as it has nothing to do with what we are discussing here. Started of OK but deteriorated.

Look Ringo, as a mod, I'm sure you'd see that the attacks were mostly one sided. My comments have almost all been in relation to the future of the BXV scoring system, whether it be how to obtain the stats to check if things are a good or bad idea before commenting, or just straight out my opinion. How would you like it if someone called you kiddo? I don't believe I have acted in any way that is inappropriate.

[kilbluff1985]

[Pkbaldy]

Lel KB

Well i apologize ringo. Shouldn't of went further. Should of found my own information to back up my first suggestions

I apologize Spite. Didnt know that you found Kiddo offense. Either used that or mate... Might just stick to mate.

[Spite]

I apologize Spite. Didnt know that you found Kiddo offense. Either used that or mate... Might just stick to mate.

Haha PK I have to wonder, do you regularly use mate and kiddo interchangeably? You didn't mean mate, you meant kiddo to be condescending. You wouldn't call Ringo kiddo but you would call him mate. I accept your apology and hope that it's now behind us mate

[Pkbaldy]

Actually i call Ringo old man on chat.

Ringo, whats your opinion on which scoring we should go with? Because i dont think Jan is a good time to find out with some of these.... otherwise it turns into a stressfest like this yearwhen sportal didnt open up.

[Pkbaldy]

Actually i call Ringo old man on chat.

Ringo, whats your opinion on which scoring we should go with? Because i dont think Jan is a good time to find out with some of these.... otherwise it turns into a stressfest like this yearwhen sportal didnt open up.

I dont think everyone will 100% agree with whatever comes up. So i trust you enough to find the best possible scoring system.

Except the one where Shaw becomes more overpowered.

[Ringo]

I will list both scoring sytems here to stimulate some more discussion.  Bear in mind we can set the points ourselves so any with a direct match will be like for like.

Sportal System Previously used
Kick    3 Points
Handball    1 Point
Contested Possession *    4 Points
Uncontested Possession **    2 Points
Tackle    3 Points
Hitout    1 Point
Clanger ***    -5 Points
Goal    6 Points
Behind    1 Point

These are the scoring categories that will be available in Ultimate Footy with the enhanced package.
KI    Kicks       
HB    Handballs       
MA    Marks       
HO    Hitouts       
TK    Tackles       
FF    Free Kicks For       
FA    Free Kicks Against       
FD    Free Kick Differential       
GL    Goals       
BH    Behinds       
D    Disposals    
ED    Effective Disposals    
IED    Ineffective Disposals    
CP    Contested Possessions    
R50    Rebound 50s        
SP    Spoils    
CL    Clearances

I have marked in green matching categories in UF.  Orange in UF are what I consider to be clangers.
Uncontested Possessions may or may not be added to UF next year.

The big question for discussion is do we want to add some going forward.
Note there is no distinction between Contested or Uncontested Marks in UF so if we ant Marks need to decide on a scoring value.
I would also like to see spoils come into our stats to make some defenders more relevant as well.
Just think the additions of Marks and Spoils would add a little to our comp. Not real keen on adding any others although there may be an argument to include clearances.

Now that we have agreed to scoring system we just need to agree on categories prior to trade period opening as it may effect players you wish to trade.

feel free to discuss further

Reposting again here so we can get back on track now.
My thoughts are we will use clangers and Uncontetsed possessions if they bring them in but if not leave them out.

Still believe we should add spoils and marks to make forwards and defenders a little more relevant. As we can set own points we will do like for like and need to just decide if we add the others and points to be awarded. I think we shopuld add both of these at points each but my opinion.

[Pkbaldy]

Fine by me.

3 or 4 for Marks and 2 for Spoils?