Where will Hawthorn finish in 2012?

[bunyip]

Ottens will be missed, that's for sure. Lingy was our best tagger and an excellent captain, but Otto was, in my opinion, a more important player. The fact is we have only lost 2 players from the GF team, albeit important ones. I have high hopes that our run has not ended yet. I see in the paper today that Vardy and Menzel are running. Vardy is more advanced, but Menzel is ahead of schedule.
Don't be surprised if another couple of young players break into the team this season MM.

[meow meow]

Hey I'm not denying that the Cats are in a heathy position to attempt to go back to back. I just rate Collingwood 5% more likely.

Collingwood haven't really lost anything, as Davis and finals don't mix. They have gained a small amount, while the Cats have lost a small amount. That's all I was saying.

Both teams have players that will come in and get their chance.

[bunyip]

Otto is a huge loss. It (his retirement) may even cause a change in our game plan.