what happens if big Cox averages 130 from the 1st 5-6 rounds???
he could be too much to bring in around bye time if he dominates
plays-
dogs rd 1
dees (home) rd 2
gws rd 3
hawks (home) rd 4
tigers rd 5
roos (home) rd 6
bombers rd 7
then a few tough ruck opponents with
saints (home) rd 8
freo rd 9
brisbane rd 10
besides NM with goldy and hmac (last year cox scored 165 against roos in rd 1), i can see big cox kicking ass in the first 7 rounds. he started very well last year.
is he too expensive? yes. - and there are good options for ruck prems this year.
BUT, if you are picking one prem ruck and 3 rookies rucks from the start is cox THAT bad of a pick still? i guess we'll know after season starts, but i don't want to not have cox if he ends up being a clear leader of all the rucks. am considering with him being my only prem with 3 rookies.
if fit, he is still the best ruckman in fantasy ::)
If Dean Cox goes nuts again, you will be far ahead over others that don't have him. Even if he misses a game or 2.
dude...SHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!! :-X
surprisingly I think Coxy will be the biggest smokie going into DT this year
only problem will be the amount of rucktime NicNat gets
but I see West Coast running with a similar strategy with the 2 rucks as they did last year start Nic in the ruck then swap Coxy through there to take the marks around the ground as he is smarter and has better skills
also as Naitinui is so dangerous as a deep, mobile, big forward (as Coxy can be). just depends on Coxys fitness and what Woosha wants out of Nics development this year
cox would be my first picked ruck if i wasn't cheaping out on rucks...
Is cox worth $110,000 odd more over leuy?? Going 1 prem 3 rooks. Is his scoring going to be that much more then leuy to warrant the money. Would like to use the money else where!
There seems so much talk of cheaping out on rucks this year, makes me wonder what has changed as this was rarely an option in the past. The byes or MPP I don't think make that much of a difference is it primarily value? And if so is this really much of a difference to prior years?
Cruiseon has a point.
But back to Coxy - I think he is the top ruck in the league; he's mobile and get plenty of touches to complement the hitouts.
I don't think he'll top last year but he'll still be in the top 3 rucks in the league. The doubt is created by his price and age and perhaps Nat's growing role in the ruck but no one could blame you for picking him despite the cost. He's a champ.
Quote from: Cruiseon on January 23, 2012, 07:04:37 PM
There seems so much talk of cheaping out on rucks this year, makes me wonder what has changed as this was rarely an option in the past. The byes or MPP I don't think make that much of a difference is it primarily value? And if so is this really much of a difference to prior years?
If you look at it, there was only one ruck that averaged over 100 last year. Why would the ruck be the place you would set and forget if there are better set and forget options elsewhere. Most of the options people are picking are closer to 90 avg. That hardly screams out to me as a must have set and forget position.
As far as Cox goes im going to get him early, coz he is going to kill everyone else by around 20 points per round for the first half of the season. Then ill pick my time and ditch him for the best value ruck at that stage before he starts to bring his avg down to far. Waste of trade, maybe. But ill risk it.
kuruki,, this is SC not DT, i think there were a few over 100 avg. ruck in SC,, sandi,mummy,burger,goldie, mcevoy...
in DT i would look at cheaper options,but not SC
662k is cox's starting SC price based on the fanplanner.
it could be a massive and somewhat unique advantage to have cox starting, and then he dominates - not many would have him and the ones that did bring him in would have to burn trades or for some reason have jags of cash in the kitty.
i don't think nicnat effects him all that much cox will still pick up possies and fact is you can't really tag a ruckman!
Quote from: Kuruki on January 23, 2012, 08:30:37 PM
Quote from: Cruiseon on January 23, 2012, 07:04:37 PM
There seems so much talk of cheaping out on rucks this year, makes me wonder what has changed as this was rarely an option in the past. The byes or MPP I don't think make that much of a difference is it primarily value? And if so is this really much of a difference to prior years?
If you look at it, there was only one ruck that averaged over 100 last year. Why would the ruck be the place you would set and forget if there are better set and forget options elsewhere. Most of the options people are picking are closer to 90 avg. That hardly screams out to me as a must have set and forget position.
As far as Cox goes im going to get him early, coz he is going to kill everyone else by around 20 points per round for the first half of the season. Then ill pick my time and ditch him for the best value ruck at that stage before he starts to bring his avg down to far. Waste of trade, maybe. But ill risk it.
i'm aware that you seemed to be referring to DT but fair question i think - why is set and forget rucks better than in any other position? because the cream of the crop of the ruck division is so much better than the next level. the points you lost from not having 2 prem rucks really adds up and you can typically pick underpriced forwards and backs.
set and forget rucks is losing popularity but it may be what sets you apart.
I still think Cox will have a great SC year, its just i think i can save money with berger and mcevoy, even though cox may average 10 more points than them
Quote from: Purple 77 on January 23, 2012, 09:51:25 PM
I still think Cox will have a great SC year, its just i think i can save money with berger and mcevoy, even though cox may average 10 more points than them
That's what I mean purple, is 10 points more a week really worth the extra cash you need to spend.
Quote from: jasonweare on January 23, 2012, 10:13:54 PM
Quote from: Purple 77 on January 23, 2012, 09:51:25 PM
I still think Cox will have a great SC year, its just i think i can save money with berger and mcevoy, even though cox may average 10 more points than them
That's what I mean purple, is 10 points more a week really worth the extra cash you need to spend.
Well it could be, but at the start of the year, you need all the cash you can get. that extra cash, which if you picked berger instead would be 100k, could be the cash that upgrades zaharakis to lance franklin, or any other situation.
Just don't think he's the right guy to start off with, what im thinking about doing, is having three rookie ruck including rowe, orren and giles, and downgrade either orren or giles (who hopefully will be about 300k after 7 or 8 rounds), trade out a forward (hopefully same value), put rowe in the forward line (new SC rule allows you to do this using only one trade) and get a ruckman that hopefully will be cox if he gets cheap enough, which is likely coz its hard to maintain that price.
yes. 10 ppg over other rucks is worth it over 22 rounds, even if he misses a game or 2.
Quote from: Purple 77 on January 23, 2012, 10:27:54 PM
Quote from: jasonweare on January 23, 2012, 10:13:54 PM
Quote from: Purple 77 on January 23, 2012, 09:51:25 PM
I still think Cox will have a great SC year, its just i think i can save money with berger and mcevoy, even though cox may average 10 more points than them
That's what I mean purple, is 10 points more a week really worth the extra cash you need to spend.
Well it could be, but at the start of the year, you need all the cash you can get. that extra cash, which if you picked berger instead would be 100k, could be the cash that upgrades zaharakis to lance franklin, or any other situation.
Just don't think he's the right guy to start off with, what im thinking about doing, is having three rookie ruck including rowe, orren and giles, and downgrade either orren or giles (who hopefully will be about 300k after 7 or 8 rounds), trade out a forward (hopefully same value), put rowe in the forward line (new SC rule allows you to do this using only one trade) and get a ruckman that hopefully will be cox if he gets cheap enough, which is likely coz its hard to maintain that price.
That's exactly what I was thinking. Berger, Giles, orren, Rowe are my current rucks. Either of them i reckon will be the zac smith of 2012. Use the new trading system to move Rowe to the forwards when it's time to upgrade using a forward cash cow.
imo, if your assuming cox would average 120 or above your better off just starting him from the get go. more likely to start off strongly I think and go backwards slightly in 2nd half.
Quote from: jasonweare on January 23, 2012, 10:13:54 PM
Quote from: Purple 77 on January 23, 2012, 09:51:25 PM
I still think Cox will have a great SC year, its just i think i can save money with berger and mcevoy, even though cox may average 10 more points than them
That's what I mean purple, is 10 points more a week really worth the extra cash you need to spend.
Quote from: charliesheen on January 23, 2012, 10:36:42 PM
yes. 10 ppg over other rucks is worth it over 22 rounds, even if he misses a game or 2.
well CS i agree, 10ppg advantage over next best ruck is worth it. i'd pick him if i knew this would happen! if he averages 120 he is worth a start. i don't think any other ruck could or will get a 120+ average in 2012 besides cox.
we are all expecting big scores from alot of ruckman this season! the more i think about it set and forget is alot better when going for overall. but you gotta nail other picks and find some value elswhere
He woud have to average 125 to be worth over that period so no for me.. As a side note when he got 165 against North he was up against pedo, as Goldy, Hmac and Petrie were all out
Quote from: Swallow12 on January 24, 2012, 08:15:04 PM
He woud have to average 125 to be worth over that period so no for me.. As a side note when he got 165 against North he was up against pedo, as Goldy, Hmac and Petrie were all out
125? What do you think the other top 4 rucks will average?
Quote from: Swallow12 on January 24, 2012, 08:15:04 PM
He woud have to average 125 to be worth over that period so no for me.. As a side note when he got 165 against North he was up against pedo, as Goldy, Hmac and Petrie were all out
Also when he scored 200+ he kicked the winning goal.
Quote from: Cruiseon on January 23, 2012, 07:04:37 PM
There seems so much talk of cheaping out on rucks this year, makes me wonder what has changed as this was rarely an option in the past. The byes or MPP I don't think make that much of a difference is it primarily value? And if so is this really much of a difference to prior years?
Last year only Mummy was anywhere near the likes of Sandi/Cox - Cox especially wa such a bargain priced at 88 and Sandi seemed a shoe in for 110+ = set and forget. The second point being that Leuy/Goldy/mcEvoy were all avg around the 60s and based on that no one was going to take a risk.
2011 saw changes to to points scoring for rucks as regards to hitouts - which massively boosted their scores. Now we have Coxy priced at 122 and people are baulking at the possibility of him repeating last season's effort.
Young rucks such as Leuy/McEvoy/Jacobs seem safe 100 point options, Sandi's toe and new coach could affect his TOG.
Finally Smith in his first year avg as well as many mids - prompting us to look at this option possibly happening again - my 2c worth.
I hear this mentioned a lot, what were the changes in regards to hit outs?
Quote from: Cruiseon on January 23, 2012, 07:04:37 PM
There seems so much talk of cheaping out on rucks this year, makes me wonder what has changed as this was rarely an option in the past. The byes or MPP I don't think make that much of a difference is it primarily value? And if so is this really much of a difference to prior years?
I think the the reason many are considering this option is the abundance of rookies likely to play games this year & score well.
In previous years R3 & R4 were not as valuable. 2 prems, a rookie likely to get some games & basically a dud. The last two unlikely to make you much cash.
This year is diff, last yr a bit as well. The new teams mean a certain starting ruck (Z.Smith), this year Giles. Throw in O.Steph (with injury to Simpson) & you have two cheap rucks that'll play a lot. Then you can pick a mid pricer & drive cash from your rucks for once!
Not saying it's the right method or wrong, just why ppl might be considering it.
Quote from: charliesheen on January 26, 2012, 07:19:28 PM
I hear this mentioned a lot, what were the changes in regards to hit outs?
Charlie i seem to recall ruckmen being awarded 1 point for every hitout (pretty sure it worked that way in DT prior to '11) and 3 points "hitout to advantage" - mate i cant give you the reference to that sadly at the moment but pretty sure that's correct.
Quote from: charliesheen on January 26, 2012, 01:35:52 PM
Quote from: Swallow12 on January 24, 2012, 08:15:04 PM
He woud have to average 125 to be worth over that period so no for me.. As a side note when he got 165 against North he was up against pedo, as Goldy, Hmac and Petrie were all out
125? What do you think the other top 4 rucks will average?
I'm not sure about about top 4, but I think Sandi can get over 125 and I think the 1 prem 3 rookies rucks is the way to go, so Cox would have to average a lot to convince me to have him from the start
Quote from: lozza63 on January 27, 2012, 04:47:07 AM
Quote from: charliesheen on January 26, 2012, 07:19:28 PM
I hear this mentioned a lot, what were the changes in regards to hit outs?
Charlie i seem to recall ruckmen being awarded 1 point for every hitout (pretty sure it worked that way in DT prior to '11) and 3 points "hitout to advantage" - mate i cant give you the reference to that sadly at the moment but pretty sure that's correct.
Can anyone confirm this point scoring?
Quote
I'm not sure about about top 4, but I think Sandi can get over 125 and I think the 1 prem 3 rookies rucks is the way to go, so Cox would have to average a lot to convince me to have him from the start
Yes this is exactly why I asked what you think the 3rd and 4th best ruckman will average. You can't just say "cox will need to average a lot more", without quantifying what the others will average.
IMO, if you think Sandilands and Cox will both average 120 (doesn't even have to be above that), you would start both from the get go.
People are fixated with this 3 rookie ruck idea without even thinking it through.
I'm taking it a step further and not playing any rucks this year.
Quote from: Swallow12 on January 28, 2012, 05:15:54 PM
Quote from: charliesheen on January 26, 2012, 01:35:52 PM
Quote from: Swallow12 on January 24, 2012, 08:15:04 PM
He woud have to average 125 to be worth over that period so no for me.. As a side note when he got 165 against North he was up against pedo, as Goldy, Hmac and Petrie were all out
125? What do you think the other top 4 rucks will average?
I'm not sure about about top 4, but I think Sandi can get over 125 and I think the 1 prem 3 rookies rucks is the way to go, so Cox would have to average a lot to convince me to have him from the start
Sorry, okay I believe there will be one or two ruckmen over 120 (Cox/Sandi/Goldy), and another two over 115 (Goldy/Mumford/other)
I have to say charliesheen you are ruining my team structure.. I'm not convinced Cox will average over 120 but I'm almost considering him for hopefully something above 116
i think its cox and mummy for no. 1 and 2 ruckman SC this year.
i'm not even considering sandi, 2 years in a row he is injured.
cox is by far the most skilled ruckman, he floats accross half back and hits targets by foot for easy possies - they don't need him forward as they have alot of marking options (WC). cox is the most expensive as he is the best. when WC play at subi its probably a massive advantage for him against the opposing ruckman - being used to the conditions (heat in WA) and the wide ground for more running.
its hard to speculate on goldy, just had his breakout year and now as a gun called Hmac back who was almost AA one year.
he is a beast though.
leuy is teasing me just due to his price and his TOG.
Would love Cox...had him initially and was swayed by opinion of the masses. As time has gone by I can't see having him anymore as it robs the rest of my team too much. Mind you if Lake doesn't hit his straps in the pre season I'll go an extra rookie in defence and then it's hello Big Cox.