I am no way a fan of the Eagles, far from it, but what has been dished out to them for the preseason games is a disgrace.
Along with the Dockers, they are the most traveled club in the competition, yet the AFL in its wisdom!!!!!!!????? decide to send them the most miles for games that almost mean JS.
What a crock of BS.
Sorry mate I will get straight onto moving west Australia next to the G
Does it really matter? Most of the time in these games you just send out a handful of senior players with the kids who are fighting for spots. Those kids most of the time aren't best 22 anyway.
Yes it does matter.The Victorian club moan and groan about coming to WA twice in a year.But that seldom happens.
What ever happened the equalisation in the AFL.OHHH that's right, that only applies to the money losing clubs from Melbourne getting hand outs from the AFL.
Quote from: anchorman on December 08, 2016, 01:42:51 AM
Yes it does matter.The Victorian club moan and groan about coming to WA twice in a year.But that seldom happens.
What ever happened the equalisation in the AFL.OHHH that's right, that only applies to the money losing clubs from Melbourne getting hand outs from the AFL.
This man has a point.
Quote from: Big Mac on December 08, 2016, 01:18:12 AM
Sorry mate I will get straight onto moving west Australia next to the G
Quote from: JBs-Hawks on December 08, 2016, 01:50:06 AM
Quote from: Big Mac on December 08, 2016, 01:18:12 AM
Sorry mate I will get straight onto moving west Australia next to the G
Wouldn't work I am afraid.That would make us as equal as the Melbourne based clubs.We couldn't have that.
I just went and looked at the fixture. Cry me a river. WC play two games in WA. The whole point of the pre-season comp is to play games in regional areas of the state so those fans can watch some AFL quality footy. It's 3 games played over a month where the players are rotated heavily and senior players maybe play 2 games. This isn't some consipiracy theory against the WA clubs, it's an opportunity for the Western Australian fans to actually watch these boys play.
The "interstate teams have to travel more so they have it tougher" sob story is getting old
Can confirm that West Aussies usually do love a cry tho no matter what the topic
Yeah look, I've always considered this a bit of a non-issue. The home ground advantage we get at Subi is a million times better than anything Melbourne clubs get at the G, especially when they play another Victorian club.
Quote from: Jukes on December 08, 2016, 02:45:39 AM
Can confirm that West Aussies usually do love a cry tho no matter what the topic
You know where the airport is bud
Anyone with any ideas about interstate clubs travelling less when there are 10 Vic clubs please post ::)
Well vic clubs (minus Geelong) only have to travel 9 other teams home games, other than that they get home games. Surely it can't be that hard to make them travel once or twice more each season and the interstate clubs have an extra game at home.
Quote from: shaker on December 08, 2016, 12:49:17 PM
Anyone with any ideas about interstate clubs travelling less when there are 10 Vic clubs please post ::)
Could just merge the WA clubs with the SA clubs and QLD clubs with the NSW clubs and all teams only have fly as far as SA and NSW.
So Crows-Eagles merger, Port-Freo merger, Brisbane-Giants and Sun-Swans... what could possibly go wrong?!
Quote from: nrich102 on December 08, 2016, 12:54:30 PM
Well vic clubs (minus Geelong) only have to travel 9 other teams home games, other than that they get home games. Surely it can't be that hard to make them travel once or twice more each season and the interstate clubs have an extra game at home.
Ok throw into that we have 23 round comp with 18 teams and the higher finishing teams get a harder draw playing top 8 teams twice that should be a piece of cake to organize :P
Quote from: elephants on December 08, 2016, 04:50:05 AM
Yeah look, I've always considered this a bit of a non-issue. The home ground advantage we get at Subi is a million times better than anything Melbourne clubs get at the G, especially when they play another Victorian club.
Ele is on the money here
Quote from: shaker on December 08, 2016, 01:01:58 PM
Quote from: nrich102 on December 08, 2016, 12:54:30 PM
Well vic clubs (minus Geelong) only have to travel 9 other teams home games, other than that they get home games. Surely it can't be that hard to make them travel once or twice more each season and the interstate clubs have an extra game at home.
Ok throw into that we have 23 round comp with 18 teams and the higher finishing teams get a harder draw playing top 8 teams twice that should be a piece of cake to organize :P
Yeah you're not wrong there. I'm sure something could be worked out tho.
Quote from: elephants on December 08, 2016, 04:50:05 AM
Yeah look, I've always considered this a bit of a non-issue. The home ground advantage we get at Subi is a million times better than anything Melbourne clubs get at the G, especially when they play another Victorian club.
Basically this. The only time a Victorian team gets a home ground advantage (not counting Geelong) it is when they are playing another interstate team. For reference, here are Carlton's games against interstate teams.
Suns @ Etihad
Swans @ MCG
Giants @ Etihad
Crows @ MCG
These are their away games
Port @ AO
Freo @ Domain
Suns @ Metricon
Brisbane @ Gabba
WC @ Domain
Swans @ SCG
That is 4 games with a perceived advantage and 6 against. That doesn't include 6 day breaks and the like. Meanwhile any interstate team has 2 neutral games and then a 50/50 split. 50% is better then 40%.
The AFL forgets where the hand that feeds them comes from. Prop up the useless broke A.F Melbourne teams, then punish the money makers from the West. Makes sense :o
Quote from: Mat0369 on December 08, 2016, 02:24:26 PM
Quote from: elephants on December 08, 2016, 04:50:05 AM
Yeah look, I've always considered this a bit of a non-issue. The home ground advantage we get at Subi is a million times better than anything Melbourne clubs get at the G, especially when they play another Victorian club.
Basically this. The only time a Victorian team gets a home ground advantage (not counting Geelong) it is when they are playing another interstate team. For reference, here are Carlton's games against interstate teams.
Suns @ Etihad
Swans @ MCG
Giants @ Etihad
Crows @ MCG
These are their away games
Port @ AO
Freo @ Domain
Suns @ Metricon
Brisbane @ Gabba
WC @ Domain
Swans @ SCG
That is 4 games with a perceived advantage and 6 against. That doesn't include 6 day breaks and the like. Meanwhile any interstate team has 2 neutral games and then a 50/50 split. 50% is better then 40%.
Its more then just what state its in.
Are people seriously saying that the Dogs at the MCG are just as good as they are at Etihad as an example or the fact that more people will obviously turn up to a home game to support there club then away. If its a home game you have more supporters turn up, the pre game is mainly about you and after every game and score. Even being a north fan its a decent amount of difference in a home and away game.
plus the argument works both ways.
yeah if your playing a home game against a victorian club you have a lower advantage then playing freo or eagles but when your away you have a bigger advantage. Plus the travel time is a killer you sit in victoria the whole teams gives you more rest, less time on a plane etc... the perth to melbourne flight isnt too much fun at all.
WA teams have a major disadvantage, they wont fix it in the real comp but they shouldnt make them move in preseason, not only that but WA teams will get big crowds at home.
Eagles are the best club in the history of AFL by a mile to be that successful with all the disadvantages, no team can compete. Sorry Hawks, North, Lions, Geelong. Essendon Collingwood Carlton fans dont even talk your successful VFL teams, your average of worse AFL teams.
Quote from: Holz on December 08, 2016, 03:42:49 PM
Even being a north fan its a decent amount of difference in a home and away game.
legit? I thought you were their only supporter?
Quote from: Holz on December 08, 2016, 03:42:49 PM
Eagles are the best club in the history of AFL by a mile to be that successful with all the disadvantages, no team can compete.
Quote from: PowerBug on December 08, 2016, 04:20:59 PM
Quote from: Holz on December 08, 2016, 03:42:49 PM
Even being a north fan its a decent amount of difference in a home and away game.
legit? I thought you were their only supporter?
I actually rarely go to games.
we actually had 45,000 members. that will fall massively because of Boomer.
Quote from: GoLions on December 08, 2016, 01:04:18 PM
Quote from: elephants on December 08, 2016, 04:50:05 AM
Yeah look, I've always considered this a bit of a non-issue. The home ground advantage we get at Subi is a million times better than anything Melbourne clubs get at the G, especially when they play another Victorian club.
Ele is on the money here
+1
Quote from: The_Captain on December 08, 2016, 02:38:52 PM
The AFL forgets where the hand that feeds them comes from. Prop up the useless broke A.F Melbourne teams, then punish the money makers from the West. Makes sense :o
Its the useless broke Melbourne teams that make the comp, imagine Melbourne only had 2 teams :o
Quote from: Football Factory on December 08, 2016, 05:12:34 PM
Quote from: The_Captain on December 08, 2016, 02:38:52 PM
The AFL forgets where the hand that feeds them comes from. Prop up the useless broke A.F Melbourne teams, then punish the money makers from the West. Makes sense :o
Its the useless broke Melbourne teams that make the comp, imagine Melbourne only had 2 teams :o
and just wont the flag :P
we need the Victorian clubs, we need the SA and WA clubs.
the thing we shouldnt be supporting is GWS and GC. Should stop pushing in Rugby areas, WA 3rd and Tasmanian is what it should have been
Yep .. 3rd WA team would have been great.
Meanwhile between the borders, Adelaide was handed a few gifts if anyone can believe that ever happening?
Firstly A hugely long travel after R1 bye (Thankyou AFL) all the way to the Docklands, oh the humanity
Then two games right here in Adelaide itself
8)
Cop that WA ;D
Quote from: Football Factory on December 08, 2016, 05:12:34 PM
Quote from: The_Captain on December 08, 2016, 02:38:52 PM
The AFL forgets where the hand that feeds them comes from. Prop up the useless broke A.F Melbourne teams, then punish the money makers from the West. Makes sense :o
Its the useless broke Melbourne teams that make the comp, imagine Melbourne only had 2 teams :o
Not saying to cut from 10 down to 2.... But should be more like 6 or 7 teams. One may have won the grandy... But that bandwagon will empty just as quickly as it filled once they're no longer at the top.
Whilst the Grand Final is played at the MCG every year there it will always be unfair to those teams that don't come from Melbourne. Now I'm not saying the GF should move from there, but it will always make it unfair in favour of the Melbourne side.
Quote from: The_Captain on December 08, 2016, 05:55:13 PM
Quote from: Football Factory on December 08, 2016, 05:12:34 PM
Quote from: The_Captain on December 08, 2016, 02:38:52 PM
The AFL forgets where the hand that feeds them comes from. Prop up the useless broke A.F Melbourne teams, then punish the money makers from the West. Makes sense :o
Its the useless broke Melbourne teams that make the comp, imagine Melbourne only had 2 teams :o
Not saying to cut from 10 down to 2.... But should be more like 6 or 7 teams. One may have won the grandy... But that bandwagon will empty just as quickly as it filled once they're no longer at the top.
Yeah but who would go? there would be some seriously unhappy supporters around. When Footscray changed to Western Bulldogs I think that was a very smart thing to do, a lot of people in the West and building.
Quote from: PowerBug on December 08, 2016, 06:16:19 PM
Whilst the Grand Final is played at the MCG every year there it will always be unfair to those teams that don't come from Melbourne. Now I'm not saying the GF should move from there, but it will always make it unfair in favour of the Melbourne side.
How many games do the interstate teams play at the MCG compared to Melbourne teams playing at interstate grounds during the year? (I honestly don't know) You cant please everyone, as controversial as this comment is I think it should just be played where it has always been played, as harsh as it is for the interstate teams and supporters. That being said I think the AFL will play a Granny interstate at some stage depending on the teams in the Grand Final obviously.
Quote from: tbagrocks on December 08, 2016, 05:29:12 PM
Meanwhile between the borders, Adelaide was handed a few gifts if anyone can believe that ever happening?
Firstly A hugely long travel after R1 bye (Thankyou AFL) all the way to the Docklands, oh the humanity
Then two games right here in Adelaide itself
8)
Cop that WA ;D
Im just glad we dont have a team full of cry baby sooks like Tom Lynch, Betts and Jacobs
Yeah but who would go? there would be some seriously unhappy supporters around. When Footscray changed to Western Bulldogs I think that was a very smart thing to do, a lot of people in the West and building.
I dont think go... that will piss a few supporters off. But several clubs should merge with other clubs who are in a similar position.
How many of us would consider a two leg type Grand Final? If interstate teams were playing, you go Adelaide Oval, Subi, SCG,Gabba & MCG as the potential grounds.
Quote from: Torpedo10 on December 08, 2016, 09:33:59 PM
How many of us would consider a two leg type Grand Final? If interstate teams were playing, you go Adelaide Oval, Subi, SCG,Gabba & MCG as the potential grounds.
I reckon it'd be cool buuuuuuut a) it'll never happen and b) I don't want it to happen because I'm a traditionalist. That last saturday in September/first saturday in October has and always will be the time when the premier is crowned imo
Quote from: elephants on December 08, 2016, 09:47:17 PM
Quote from: Torpedo10 on December 08, 2016, 09:33:59 PM
How many of us would consider a two leg type Grand Final? If interstate teams were playing, you go Adelaide Oval, Subi, SCG,Gabba & MCG as the potential grounds.
I reckon it'd be cool buuuuuuut a) it'll never happen and b) I don't want it to happen because I'm a traditionalist. That last saturday in September/first saturday in October has and always will be the time when the premier is crowned imo
It still will be though. Just make the 2nd Leg at the MCG on the second Saturday in October. ;)
Quote from: PowerBug on December 08, 2016, 06:16:19 PM
Whilst the Grand Final is played at the MCG every year there it will always be unfair to those teams that don't come from Melbourne. Now I'm not saying the GF should move from there, but it will always make it unfair in favour of the Melbourne side.
its also not fair to clbs like the dog who there home ground is Etihad not the MCG. People seem to totally disregard the ground. However when its Sydney or Cats they go well Syndey has this is the bag its small SCG comapred to ANZ or its in Geelong not MCG so cats cant lose.
The best teams can win anywhere
/End discussion ;)
Quote from: RaisyDaisy on December 09, 2016, 10:44:01 AM
The best teams can win anywhere
/End discussion ;)
The best team can lose to a marginally worse team with an advantage.
Its why the eagles are soo good,
Hawks 5 flags from 6 grand finals.
Eagles 3 flags from 6 grand finals.
Cats 3 flags from 7 grand finals.
Lions 3 flags from 4 grand finals.
the 4 powerhouses of the AFL.
Lions did it in 1 run so discount that.
Geelong did it in 1 patch and was good in the mid 90s but didnt win.
Eagles made grand final in 3 periods and have the disadvantage of playing away in everyone.
Hawks in 3 periods and been more successful on grandfinal day but have advatnage of being at home every time.
Reckon its close between hawks and eagles despite the 5 flags v 3 flags.
Quote from: Holz on December 09, 2016, 12:32:44 PM
Quote from: RaisyDaisy on December 09, 2016, 10:44:01 AM
The best teams can win anywhere
/End discussion ;)
The best team can lose to a marginally worse team with an advantage.
Its why the eagles are soo good,
Hawks 5 flags from 6 grand finals.
Eagles 3 flags from 6 grand finals.
Cats 3 flags from 7 grand finals.
Lions 3 flags from 4 grand finals.
the 4 powerhouses of the AFL.
Lions did it in 1 run so discount that.
Geelong did it in 1 patch and was good in the mid 90s but didnt win.
Eagles made grand final in 3 periods and have the disadvantage of playing away in everyone.
Hawks in 3 periods and been more successful on grandfinal day but have advatnage of being at home every time.
Reckon its close between hawks and eagles despite the 5 flags v 3 flags.
Ok so we'll also discount the Hawks 3 in a row cause that was just 1 run, and then discount the early Hawks and Iggs flags as the Lions weren't in the AFL at the time :P
Lions GOAT ;D
Meanwhile after a busy few days looked at Lions Draw and we only play the one game in Qld and that is at Metricon down the coast. Others are Etihad and Hickinbotham Oval, Noarlung. Had to search where Noarllunga is. So we travel a fair bit as well.
Quote from: GoLions on December 09, 2016, 12:51:42 PM
Quote from: Holz on December 09, 2016, 12:32:44 PM
Quote from: RaisyDaisy on December 09, 2016, 10:44:01 AM
The best teams can win anywhere
/End discussion ;)
The best team can lose to a marginally worse team with an advantage.
Its why the eagles are soo good,
Hawks 5 flags from 6 grand finals.
Eagles 3 flags from 6 grand finals.
Cats 3 flags from 7 grand finals.
Lions 3 flags from 4 grand finals.
the 4 powerhouses of the AFL.
Lions did it in 1 run so discount that.
Geelong did it in 1 patch and was good in the mid 90s but didnt win.
Eagles made grand final in 3 periods and have the disadvantage of playing away in everyone.
Hawks in 3 periods and been more successful on grandfinal day but have advatnage of being at home every time.
Reckon its close between hawks and eagles despite the 5 flags v 3 flags.
Ok so we'll also discount the Hawks 3 in a row cause that was just 1 run, and then discount the early Hawks and Iggs flags as the Lions weren't in the AFL at the time :P
Lions GOAT ;D
So when the Lions win 4 in a row from 2019 we will discount that as well based on your theory. And looking back through history the Lions played less games at the G than Eagles. So yer we are GOAT.
Quote from: GoLions on December 09, 2016, 12:51:42 PM
Quote from: Holz on December 09, 2016, 12:32:44 PM
Quote from: RaisyDaisy on December 09, 2016, 10:44:01 AM
The best teams can win anywhere
/End discussion ;)
The best team can lose to a marginally worse team with an advantage.
Its why the eagles are soo good,
Hawks 5 flags from 6 grand finals.
Eagles 3 flags from 6 grand finals.
Cats 3 flags from 7 grand finals.
Lions 3 flags from 4 grand finals.
the 4 powerhouses of the AFL.
Lions did it in 1 run so discount that.
Geelong did it in 1 patch and was good in the mid 90s but didnt win.
Eagles made grand final in 3 periods and have the disadvantage of playing away in everyone.
Hawks in 3 periods and been more successful on grandfinal day but have advatnage of being at home every time.
Reckon its close between hawks and eagles despite the 5 flags v 3 flags.
Ok so we'll also discount the Hawks 3 in a row cause that was just 1 run, and then discount the early Hawks and Iggs flags as the Lions weren't in the AFL at the time :P
Lions GOAT ;D
lions where basically good for 4 years then have been shocking for pretty much the rest of the time.
Eagles and hawks have had 3 periods of being successful. let alone the 6 grandfinals compared to 2.
if Lions win 4 in a row from 2019 to 2022 ill leave FF forever.
I reckon they will be lucky to make the finals 4 years in a row.
Hawks are GOAT how is this even a discussion :P
Holz, your need to have a different or controversial opinion/theory gives me aids.
Quote from: Vinny on December 09, 2016, 05:29:22 PM
Holz, your need to have a different or controversial opinion/theory gives me aids.
I just love that its a non West Coast fan making the argument :)
Quote from: Gigantor on December 09, 2016, 05:42:01 PM
Quote from: Vinny on December 09, 2016, 05:29:22 PM
Holz, your need to have a different or controversial opinion/theory gives me aids.
I just love that its a non West Coast fan making the argument :)
Alot of West Coast fans seem to have the same opinion as me :P
wouldnt say i have said too many controversial teams, Eagles are clearly top 2 with Hawks so its just that i have them 1. I think that constantly traveling is a big disadvantage and the biggest to WA. I also think that just because your playing in the same state there is a difference in etihad v mcg extra..
makes total sense if you know im from WA get tired myself from the melbourne to perth travel and support a club that plays at Eithad Stadium.
I just argue for what right, not my fault everyone else is wrong. there is your controversial statement :P
Lel @ teams with less than 16 flags
Quote from: PowerBug on December 09, 2016, 11:43:48 PM
Quote from: Jukes on December 09, 2016, 11:32:34 PM
Lel @ teams with less than 16 flags
Lel at teams with less than 30
Did I really need to specify 16 flags in Australia's premier competition?
Poort
tarps fans need not apply
Quote from: Vinny on December 09, 2016, 05:29:22 PM
Holz, your need to have a different or controversial opinion/theory gives me aids.
I love you vinny
Nothing against you holz, I just love vinny
Quote from: Jukes on December 09, 2016, 11:32:34 PM
Lel @ teams with less than 16 flags
Even bigger lel at teams with less than 3 AFL flags
Cracks me up how Ess/Car/Coll etc supporters continually cheer about how proud they are for all the flags they've won when most of them were won in a comp when you had a 1 in 8 or so chance, never traveled, and a lot where decided by bs challenges, etc
Quote from: Big Mac on December 10, 2016, 12:11:54 AM
Quote from: Vinny on December 09, 2016, 05:29:22 PM
Holz, your need to have a different or controversial opinion/theory gives me aids.
I love you vinny
Nothing against you holz, I just love vinny
Me too thanks.
Quote from: RaisyDaisy on December 10, 2016, 02:44:29 PM
Quote from: Jukes on December 09, 2016, 11:32:34 PM
Lel @ teams with less than 16 flags
Even bigger lel at teams with less than 3 AFL flags
Cracks me up how Ess/Car/Coll etc supporters continually cheer about how proud they are for all the flags they've won when most of them were won in a comp when you had a 1 in 8 or so chance, never traveled, and a lot where decided by bs challenges, etc
and at most have 1 flag in their lifetime.
Quote from: RaisyDaisy on December 10, 2016, 02:44:29 PM
Quote from: Jukes on December 09, 2016, 11:32:34 PM
Lel @ teams with less than 16 flags
Even bigger lel at teams with less than 3 AFL flags
Cracks me up how Ess/Car/Coll etc supporters continually cheer about how proud they are for all the flags they've won when most of them were won in a comp when you had a 1 in 8 or so chance, never traveled, and a lot where decided by bs challenges, etc
+1
Quote from: RaisyDaisy on December 10, 2016, 02:44:29 PM
Quote from: Jukes on December 09, 2016, 11:32:34 PM
Lel @ teams with less than 16 flags
Even bigger lel at teams with less than 3 AFL flags
Cracks me up how Ess/Car/Coll etc supporters continually cheer about how proud they are for all the flags they've won when most of them were won in a comp when you had a 1 in 8 or so chance, never traveled, and a lot where decided by bs challenges, etc
This tall poppy syndrome tho
(http://resources2.news.com.au/images/2013/11/19/1226763/079726-a09fb32c-50a0-11e3-9770-07dcc52d4773.jpg)
Btw eagles fans can't talk, won two cups as a state team against 10 suburb teams so those are far less worthy than an 1897 flag in an equal competition. How does a whole state not beat a load of suburb teams every year? It's quite pathetic tbh.
Also fact RD and Holz only jumped on their teams bandwagon because of 92 94 96 and/or 99
Just stating the facts, ignorance is no excuse.
In a National Comp all that matters is how many Cups you have won in that comp. VFL is not the AFL.
Clubs have X amount of VFL flags and X amount of AFL flags never the two shall be confused as the same.
Quote from: Jukes on December 10, 2016, 05:15:45 PM
Quote from: RaisyDaisy on December 10, 2016, 02:44:29 PM
Quote from: Jukes on December 09, 2016, 11:32:34 PM
Lel @ teams with less than 16 flags
Even bigger lel at teams with less than 3 AFL flags
Cracks me up how Ess/Car/Coll etc supporters continually cheer about how proud they are for all the flags they've won when most of them were won in a comp when you had a 1 in 8 or so chance, never traveled, and a lot where decided by bs challenges, etc
This tall poppy syndrome tho
(http://resources2.news.com.au/images/2013/11/19/1226763/079726-a09fb32c-50a0-11e3-9770-07dcc52d4773.jpg)
Btw eagles fans can't talk, won two cups as a state team against 10 suburb teams so those are far less worthy than an 1897 flag in an equal competition. How does a whole state not beat a load of suburb teams every year? It's quite pathetic tbh.
Also fact RD and Holz only jumped on their teams bandwagon because of 92 94 96 and/or 99
ok if we are going down that route then Port have 37 flags and are easily the best club ever.
/thread
Yeh the Power folk love spitting that out out Holz, same rules apply lol. :P
Quote from: Grazz on December 10, 2016, 06:26:21 PM
Just stating the facts, ignorance is no excuse.
In a National Comp all that matters is how many Cups you have won in that comp. VFL is not the AFL.
Clubs have X amount of VFL flags and X amount of AFL flags never the two shall be confused as the same.
This is what is true imo. Why the AFL hasn't split the records up I don't know...
Most of the best players in Australia played in the VFL because it was the premier competition, that's why it became the AFL :P
Quote from: Football Factory on December 10, 2016, 10:10:50 PM
Most of the best players in Australia played in the VFL because it was the premier competition, that's why it became the AFL :P
Still changed to the AFL, and the VFL didn't stop, it's still there today.
Anyway, we're getting off topic here :P
Quote from: PowerBug on December 10, 2016, 10:40:46 PM
Still changed to the AFL, and the VFL didn't stop, it's still there today.
Anyway, we're getting off topic here :P
The AFL is an expansion of the VFL which is why you have to count the history of the league. Just because you expend, it doesn't mean you discredit everything prior to the point of the expansion. Otherwise why bother counting stuff prior to the induction of GWS and GC?
If you want to no longer recognise the premierships does that mean you also discount the Brownlow and split it?
Also the VFL in it's current form is the old VFA re-branded.
Speaking of dud fixtures, turns out we have to play in Casey and Perth in the pre-season. The roads to get out to Casey are freaking awful.
Quote from: PowerBug on December 10, 2016, 10:40:46 PM
Anyway, we're getting off topic here :P
Was there ever a point of this thread other than to start this discussion?
Quote from: nrich102 on December 11, 2016, 12:46:27 AM
Quote from: PowerBug on December 10, 2016, 10:40:46 PM
Anyway, we're getting off topic here :P
Was there ever a point of this thread other than to start this discussion?
Unless interstate teams want 10 matches vs their rival every year, impossible to play 17 games inside the state like Victorian teams do. It's just a fact that we have to get over. It only seems to come up when the teams are shower. Good teams win anywhere
Posts photo of 16 cups in a glass case the club had to beg/ fundraise money for to fund with their training facility. bahahahahah. Real success....
Quote from: Grazz on December 10, 2016, 06:26:21 PM
Just stating the facts, ignorance is no excuse.
In a National Comp all that matters is how many Cups you have won in that comp. VFL is not the AFL.
Clubs have X amount of VFL flags and X amount of AFL flags never the two shall be confused as the same.
Preach!
Doe's seem a bit precious how Vic teams count all THEIR cups, and interstate teams can't count theirs. Only good thing I suppose, is if you go to a bbq with your Vic mates, theres plenty of cups
Quote from: Dudge on December 12, 2016, 06:44:47 PM
Doe's seem a bit precious how Vic teams count all THEIR cups, and interstate teams can't count theirs. Only good thing I suppose, is if you go to a bbq with your Vic mates, theres plenty of cups
Just be careful of what's in the cups at a Port Adelaide BBQ ???
Quote from: tbagrocks on December 12, 2016, 09:21:50 PM
Quote from: Dudge on December 12, 2016, 06:44:47 PM
Doe's seem a bit precious how Vic teams count all THEIR cups, and interstate teams can't count theirs. Only good thing I suppose, is if you go to a bbq with your Vic mates, theres plenty of cups
Just be careful of what's in the cups at a Port Adelaide BBQ ???
I hear they use their tarps as some sort of filtering system nowadays
Quote from: Holz on December 08, 2016, 05:17:17 PM
the thing we shouldnt be supporting is GWS and GC. Should stop pushing in Rugby areas, WA 3rd and Tasmanian is what it should have been
^^ close to my number one argument I have with strangers
Quote from: Purple 77 on December 12, 2016, 09:26:48 PM
Quote from: Holz on December 08, 2016, 05:17:17 PM
the thing we shouldnt be supporting is GWS and GC. Should stop pushing in Rugby areas, WA 3rd and Tasmanian is what it should have been
^^ close to my number one argument I have with strangers
As a qlder I even agree - The AFL will always have to spend money to prop up the 2 teams in a very competitive market. Reckon they should only have the one team in Qld and at least it will save money. However for what it is worth Auskick has more participants in Qld than other codes which is interesting.
Quote from: Ringo on December 12, 2016, 09:37:11 PM
Quote from: Purple 77 on December 12, 2016, 09:26:48 PM
Quote from: Holz on December 08, 2016, 05:17:17 PM
the thing we shouldnt be supporting is GWS and GC. Should stop pushing in Rugby areas, WA 3rd and Tasmanian is what it should have been
^^ close to my number one argument I have with strangers
As a qlder I even agree - The AFL will always have to spend money to prop up the 2 teams in a very competitive market. Reckon they should only have the one team in Qld and at least it will save money. However for what it is worth Auskick has more participants in Qld than other codes which is interesting.
Will not disagree with a Tassy team, think GC/GWS is better than another WA team though. Don't really know enough there for my opinion to have much weight tho.
I think the benefits of Auskick will be seen down the track. If kids keep playing footy after Auskick and grow into the game they will support the Lions/Suns (unless they're bandwagoning flogs :P). They just have to make sure it doesn't go the same way as football.
Yeah I argued that Tassy should have been the 18th team ;)
Our major obstacle is that we are already a tapped out market. The AFL basically gets its maximum revenue from Tasmania, so if it put in its huge investments to get us started, it won't really be getting any (noticeable) extra gross income.
Eh. I live in hope. Still, I do look at the "Victorian teams v non-victorian teams" debate as a neutral, with great interest
Definitely Tassie, dunno about a 3rd WA team tbh
Quote from: elephants on December 13, 2016, 05:29:35 AM
Definitely Tassie, dunno about a 3rd WA team tbh
Westcoast will always have their fans.
Freo obviously represents Fremantle
The area that is grwoing in WA is the north and we have a strong north v south identity.
West represents the west, fremantle basically the south and I say Joondalup representing the north. Will help as 1-2 more WA games to help the eagles and freo out.
i think its safe to say a 3rd WA team would get alot more people at the game then GWS GC, especially if they are a contender in a few years like GWS is.
Could work but it would destroy our WAFL
Quote from: Ricochet on December 13, 2016, 11:11:47 AM
Could work but it would destroy our WAFL
your probably correct there.
Eagles and Freo pretty much did.
Joondalup got 6,090 people to the West perth v Subiaco game which is pretty crazy now that6 must have been a special day as they usually get like 1.5 -2k.
but pretty crazy that they can go over half an AFL game (at the offical home ground)
I hate the argument re: travelling. Any disadvantage you have when you have travel away is countered by the advantage you get when other teams travel to you. Basically what Ele said :P
Vic teams don't have to travel so often, but they also play several home games with little/no home ground advantage. Interstate teams all only have 1 game which has limited advantage (against their home-state rival obviously).
I will concede the argument that it is unfair having the MCG as the staple GF match venue but ONLY when it's a higher ranked interstate team v a Victorian team. If it's interstate v interstate, it's a neutral venue anyway. Same if it's Vic v Vic. And if it's higher ranked Vic team v interstate team, they 'deserve' the advantage anyway. Having said that, it's totally understandable that the AFL has it there due to it's capacity. As a fan, you'd surely want the best chance possible of getting a ticket to go see your team play in one (if there was alternate venues, all clubs would have to significantly lower their current amount of guaranteed finals ticket members, and it would almost be impossible to get one outside of there anyway).
And that unfair GF advantage you speak of has happened 3 years in a row now ;) (Just saying! :P)
Quote from: PowerBug on December 15, 2016, 11:43:27 PM
And that unfair GF advantage you speak of has happened 3 years in a row now ;) (Just saying! :P)
Don't think it did in 2015, when Hawks beat Freo in the prelim they become the 1st ranked team because they beat the 1st ranked team ;)
Quote from: Scrads on December 15, 2016, 11:55:51 PM
Quote from: PowerBug on December 15, 2016, 11:43:27 PM
And that unfair GF advantage you speak of has happened 3 years in a row now ;) (Just saying! :P)
Don't think it did in 2015, when Hawks beat Freo in the prelim they become the 1st ranked team because they beat the 1st ranked team ;)
I was just going off ladder positions but if you say that's how it goes :o
Quote from: PowerBug on December 16, 2016, 12:06:16 AM
Quote from: Scrads on December 15, 2016, 11:55:51 PM
Quote from: PowerBug on December 15, 2016, 11:43:27 PM
And that unfair GF advantage you speak of has happened 3 years in a row now ;) (Just saying! :P)
Don't think it did in 2015, when Hawks beat Freo in the prelim they become the 1st ranked team because they beat the 1st ranked team ;)
I was just going off ladder positions but if you say that's how it goes :o
Well if you think about it, if 4th beats 1st in the first week, they'll still get a home final in week 3 even if they have to play 2nd or 3rd in that game ;)
Quote from: Scrads on December 15, 2016, 11:24:18 PM
Bassically what Ele said :P
If I had a dollar! Man its tiring being so right all the time
Quote from: Scrads on December 15, 2016, 11:24:18 PM
I hate the argument re: travelling. Any disadvantage you have when you have travel away is countered by the advantage you get when other teams travel to you. Basically what Ele said :P
Vic teams don't have to travel so often, but they also play several home games with little/no home ground advantage. Interstate teams all only have 1 game which has limited advantage (against their home-state rival obviously).
I will concede the argument that it is unfair having the MCG as the staple GF match venue but ONLY when it's a higher ranked interstate team v a Victorian team. If it's interstate v interstate, it's a neutral venue anyway. Same if it's Vic v Vic. And if it's higher ranked Vic team v interstate team, they 'deserve' the advantage anyway. Having said that, it's totally understandable that the AFL has it there due to it's capacity. As a fan, you'd surely want the best chance possible of getting a ticket to go see your team play in one (if there was alternate venues, all clubs would have to significantly lower their current amount of guaranteed finals ticket members, and it would almost be impossible to get one outside of there anyway).
The travel is tiring in my opinion it's a bigger issue then crowd cheering. As I have said ground size is more important then crowd noise.
Scg v ANZ is big for Sydney despite being the home team on both.
Being able to stay in your house to go to a game in Melbourne is far easier then hoping on a plane staying at a hotel. Then flying home quickly as opposed to driving back to your training centre to recover.
Quote from: Holz on December 16, 2016, 11:27:39 AM
Quote from: Scrads on December 15, 2016, 11:24:18 PM
I hate the argument re: travelling. Any disadvantage you have when you have travel away is countered by the advantage you get when other teams travel to you. Basically what Ele said :P
Vic teams don't have to travel so often, but they also play several home games with little/no home ground advantage. Interstate teams all only have 1 game which has limited advantage (against their home-state rival obviously).
I will concede the argument that it is unfair having the MCG as the staple GF match venue but ONLY when it's a higher ranked interstate team v a Victorian team. If it's interstate v interstate, it's a neutral venue anyway. Same if it's Vic v Vic. And if it's higher ranked Vic team v interstate team, they 'deserve' the advantage anyway. Having said that, it's totally understandable that the AFL has it there due to it's capacity. As a fan, you'd surely want the best chance possible of getting a ticket to go see your team play in one (if there was alternate venues, all clubs would have to significantly lower their current amount of guaranteed finals ticket members, and it would almost be impossible to get one outside of there anyway).
The travel is tiring in my opinion it's a bigger issue then crowd cheering. As I have said ground size is more important then crowd noise.
Scg v ANZ is big for Sydney despite being the home team on both.
Being able to stay in your house to go to a game in Melbourne is far easier then hoping on a plane staying at a hotel. Then flying home quickly as opposed to driving back to your training centre to recover.
Yeah, I don't see how that counters my argument at all? Vic teams play several home games against other Vic teams who 'sleep in their own house etc' whereas every team except the cross-town rival has to 'get on a plane/hotel' when they play away to a WA team. I'm saying it completely evens out.
Let us all not forget the most important factor is the team you play against btw. I'd be more than happy for Hawks to travel to Brisbane for all 22 games than to play at home against Sydney for 22 games.
Quote from: Scrads on December 16, 2016, 11:49:01 AM
Quote from: Holz on December 16, 2016, 11:27:39 AM
Quote from: Scrads on December 15, 2016, 11:24:18 PM
I hate the argument re: travelling. Any disadvantage you have when you have travel away is countered by the advantage you get when other teams travel to you. Basically what Ele said :P
Vic teams don't have to travel so often, but they also play several home games with little/no home ground advantage. Interstate teams all only have 1 game which has limited advantage (against their home-state rival obviously).
I will concede the argument that it is unfair having the MCG as the staple GF match venue but ONLY when it's a higher ranked interstate team v a Victorian team. If it's interstate v interstate, it's a neutral venue anyway. Same if it's Vic v Vic. And if it's higher ranked Vic team v interstate team, they 'deserve' the advantage anyway. Having said that, it's totally understandable that the AFL has it there due to it's capacity. As a fan, you'd surely want the best chance possible of getting a ticket to go see your team play in one (if there was alternate venues, all clubs would have to significantly lower their current amount of guaranteed finals ticket members, and it would almost be impossible to get one outside of there anyway).
The travel is tiring in my opinion it's a bigger issue then crowd cheering. As I have said ground size is more important then crowd noise.
Scg v ANZ is big for Sydney despite being the home team on both.
Being able to stay in your house to go to a game in Melbourne is far easier then hoping on a plane staying at a hotel. Then flying home quickly as opposed to driving back to your training centre to recover.
Yeah, I don't see how that counters my argument at all? Vic teams play several home games against other Vic teams who 'sleep in their own house etc' whereas every team except the cross-town rival has to 'get on a plane/hotel' when they play away to a WA team. I'm saying it completely evens out.
Let us all not forget the most important factor is the team you play against btw. I'd be more than happy for Hawks to travel to Brisbane for all 22 games than to play at home against Sydney for 22 games.
would have thought the fact most teams play on average 2 games in WA where the WA teams play pretty much 11 games a long way from home is pretty self explanatory.
Then even if they are the number 1 team they at least have to play one game in Melbourne (the grand final)
Quote from: Holz on December 16, 2016, 01:08:03 PM
Quote from: Scrads on December 16, 2016, 11:49:01 AM
Quote from: Holz on December 16, 2016, 11:27:39 AM
Quote from: Scrads on December 15, 2016, 11:24:18 PM
I hate the argument re: travelling. Any disadvantage you have when you have travel away is countered by the advantage you get when other teams travel to you. Basically what Ele said :P
Vic teams don't have to travel so often, but they also play several home games with little/no home ground advantage. Interstate teams all only have 1 game which has limited advantage (against their home-state rival obviously).
I will concede the argument that it is unfair having the MCG as the staple GF match venue but ONLY when it's a higher ranked interstate team v a Victorian team. If it's interstate v interstate, it's a neutral venue anyway. Same if it's Vic v Vic. And if it's higher ranked Vic team v interstate team, they 'deserve' the advantage anyway. Having said that, it's totally understandable that the AFL has it there due to it's capacity. As a fan, you'd surely want the best chance possible of getting a ticket to go see your team play in one (if there was alternate venues, all clubs would have to significantly lower their current amount of guaranteed finals ticket members, and it would almost be impossible to get one outside of there anyway).
The travel is tiring in my opinion it's a bigger issue then crowd cheering. As I have said ground size is more important then crowd noise.
Scg v ANZ is big for Sydney despite being the home team on both.
Being able to stay in your house to go to a game in Melbourne is far easier then hoping on a plane staying at a hotel. Then flying home quickly as opposed to driving back to your training centre to recover.
Yeah, I don't see how that counters my argument at all? Vic teams play several home games against other Vic teams who 'sleep in their own house etc' whereas every team except the cross-town rival has to 'get on a plane/hotel' when they play away to a WA team. I'm saying it completely evens out.
Let us all not forget the most important factor is the team you play against btw. I'd be more than happy for Hawks to travel to Brisbane for all 22 games than to play at home against Sydney for 22 games.
would have thought the fact most teams play on average 2 games in WA where the WA teams play pretty much 11 games a long way from home is pretty self explanatory.
Then even if they are the number 1 team they at least have to play one game in Melbourne (the grand final)
But the WA (and all interstate teams) have better HGA at home games, and more often than Vic teams.
West Coast:
11 home games, 10 against travelling opposition
Vic Teams:
11 home games, MAX of 8 against travelling opposition, but most often 4-5 (at a guess).
Quote from: tbagrocks on December 12, 2016, 09:21:50 PM
Quote from: Dudge on December 12, 2016, 06:44:47 PM
Doe's seem a bit precious how Vic teams count all THEIR cups, and interstate teams can't count theirs. Only good thing I suppose, is if you go to a bbq with your Vic mates, theres plenty of cups
Just be careful of what's in the cups at a Port Adelaide BBQ ???
Westend mate, just plain old Westend ;)
Quote from: Dudge on December 16, 2016, 11:15:25 PM
Quote from: tbagrocks on December 12, 2016, 09:21:50 PM
Quote from: Dudge on December 12, 2016, 06:44:47 PM
Doe's seem a bit precious how Vic teams count all THEIR cups, and interstate teams can't count theirs. Only good thing I suppose, is if you go to a bbq with your Vic mates, theres plenty of cups
Just be careful of what's in the cups at a Port Adelaide BBQ ???
Westend mate, just plain old Westend ;)
Exactly
be careful
Quote from: GoLions on December 12, 2016, 09:23:14 PM
Quote from: tbagrocks on December 12, 2016, 09:21:50 PM
Quote from: Dudge on December 12, 2016, 06:44:47 PM
Doe's seem a bit precious how Vic teams count all THEIR cups, and interstate teams can't count theirs. Only good thing I suppose, is if you go to a bbq with your Vic mates, theres plenty of cups
Just be careful of what's in the cups at a Port Adelaide BBQ ???
I hear they use their tarps as some sort of filtering system nowadays
Not nice GL, still smarting over 2004 ;)
Plus I'd more expect that from a Crows supporter haha
Quote from: JBs-Hawks on December 16, 2016, 11:17:30 PM
Quote from: Dudge on December 16, 2016, 11:15:25 PM
Quote from: tbagrocks on December 12, 2016, 09:21:50 PM
Quote from: Dudge on December 12, 2016, 06:44:47 PM
Doe's seem a bit precious how Vic teams count all THEIR cups, and interstate teams can't count theirs. Only good thing I suppose, is if you go to a bbq with your Vic mates, theres plenty of cups
Just be careful of what's in the cups at a Port Adelaide BBQ ???
Westend mate, just plain old Westend ;)
Exactly be careful
Lol
Quote from: Dudge on December 12, 2016, 06:44:47 PM
Doe's seem a bit precious how Vic teams count all THEIR cups, and interstate teams can't count theirs. Only good thing I suppose, is if you go to a bbq with your Vic mates, theres plenty of cups
The VFL had most of the best players in Australia playing in it, it was the Premier Competition, that's why it became the AFL. If all the best players in Australia were playing in the SANFL and it was the premier competition and became the AFL then they should count their cups also :P
Quote from: Football Factory on December 17, 2016, 04:27:15 PM
Quote from: Dudge on December 12, 2016, 06:44:47 PM
Doe's seem a bit precious how Vic teams count all THEIR cups, and interstate teams can't count theirs. Only good thing I suppose, is if you go to a bbq with your Vic mates, theres plenty of cups
The VFL had most of the best players in Australia playing in it, it was the Premier Competition, that's why it became the AFL. If all the best players in Australia were playing in the SANFL and it was the premier competition and became the AFL then they should count their cups also :P
you can take this argument in any direction you want.
I say none should count in any comp before the AFL.
1. Today it is a highly professional environment where not only is it a full time job but potentially a very lucrative one of that.
2 There is alot more teams so on average if there is 18 teams and you play for 100 years and your just a average team you should win 5-6 flags. If there is 8 teams and you play for 100 years an average team should win 12-13 flags.
counting a 1897 comp in which there where 8 teams (of which 1 was a complete joke 281 points scored to 966 conceded and another was worse then GWS GC ever was)
so realistically a 6 team comp in which they where a bunch of people playing on a weekend for fun and the grandfinal was won 38 to 23.
Should in know way be valued equally as winning a 18 team comp like Dogs in which all the players dedicate all their time to winning have sports nutrionist, phscologists, trainers, medicos, full time coaches etc.. working on getting a win.
Just find it funny that a team that has won 4 flags in the last 50 years in which the game was turning into a proper sport can be considered the best club out there. When it actually is below average in how many it should have won.
Collingwood the apparent 3rd best team has won a shocking 2 which is an embarrassing amount.
Then Hawthorn who people claim isnt on the level of Collingwood Essendon Carlton has won 12!!!!!
Im sorry but if you only count AFL then Eagles v Hawks are the most succesfull clubs ever. If you do count the VFL then Hawthorn is by far the most succesfull club ever it is not even close.
12 Flags in the last 50 years which is double that of the powerhouses Collingwood and Essendon combined.
A couple of things
1) Who cares about pre season travelling, it's just a competition to give the kids a run.
2) I completely agree that VFL flags shouldn't be counted to AFL totals. Yes, the VFL was the premier competition at the time, but you can't go comparing a state competition to a national competition. I'm not really fussed over the number of teams etc, the idea is that the VFL for for Victoria and the AFL is for Australia, it's a pretty easy distinction imo.
3) Regarding expansion teams... obviously I support GWS, so maybe I'm biased (albeit it, I think I'm correct). It makes wayyy more sense for the AFL to drop in a 2nd sydney team than a tassie or 3rd WA team. The entire tasmanian population is 500k, the entire WA population is 2.6 mil, while Sydney's population alone is 4.3 mil, the size of the potential markets alone are massive. A team is either Tas/WA would basically be getting supporters (and therefore $$$) from people changing clubs, rather than new fans since AFL's already the dominant sport. Another team in NSW has so many more potential new fans (and therefore more $$$).
The same logic can be applied to queensland which is the 3rd largest state behind NSW and Vic. I mean, fairness would dictate that tassie deserved a team, but when it comes down to it the AFL is a corporate machine, they're going to go where the money is.
Quote from: Scrads on December 16, 2016, 11:49:01 AM
Quote from: Holz on December 16, 2016, 11:27:39 AM
Quote from: Scrads on December 15, 2016, 11:24:18 PM
I hate the argument re: travelling. Any disadvantage you have when you have travel away is countered by the advantage you get when other teams travel to you. Basically what Ele said :P
Vic teams don't have to travel so often, but they also play several home games with little/no home ground advantage. Interstate teams all only have 1 game which has limited advantage (against their home-state rival obviously).
I will concede the argument that it is unfair having the MCG as the staple GF match venue but ONLY when it's a higher ranked interstate team v a Victorian team. If it's interstate v interstate, it's a neutral venue anyway. Same if it's Vic v Vic. And if it's higher ranked Vic team v interstate team, they 'deserve' the advantage anyway. Having said that, it's totally understandable that the AFL has it there due to it's capacity. As a fan, you'd surely want the best chance possible of getting a ticket to go see your team play in one (if there was alternate venues, all clubs would have to significantly lower their current amount of guaranteed finals ticket members, and it would almost be impossible to get one outside of there anyway).
The travel is tiring in my opinion it's a bigger issue then crowd cheering. As I have said ground size is more important then crowd noise.
Scg v ANZ is big for Sydney despite being the home team on both.
Being able to stay in your house to go to a game in Melbourne is far easier then hoping on a plane staying at a hotel. Then flying home quickly as opposed to driving back to your training centre to recover.
Yeah, I don't see how that counters my argument at all? Vic teams play several home games against other Vic teams who 'sleep in their own house etc' whereas every team except the cross-town rival has to 'get on a plane/hotel' when they play away to a WA team. I'm saying it completely evens out.
Let us all not forget the most important factor is the team you play against btw. I'd be more than happy for Hawks to travel to Brisbane for all 22 games than to play at home against Sydney for 22 games.
Bit of a flawed example... I mean anyone would prefer to play brisbane 22 games a year over sydney for about any year in the past 10 years :P
I guess it comes down to who you barrack for as to whether you think they should be counted or not.
Quote from: Ziplock on December 19, 2016, 01:51:12 PM
Quote from: Scrads on December 15, 2016, 11:24:18 PM
Let us all not forget the most important factor is the team you play against btw. I'd be more than happy for Hawks to travel to Brisbane for all 22 games than to play at home against Sydney for 22 games.
Bit of a flawed example... I mean anyone would prefer to play brisbane 22 games a year over sydney for about any year in the past 10 years :P
It was a deliberate hyperbole to re-iterate that who you play is always considerably more important than where you play :P
Quote from: Scrads on December 19, 2016, 03:28:13 PM
Quote from: Ziplock on December 19, 2016, 01:51:12 PM
Quote from: Scrads on December 15, 2016, 11:24:18 PM
Let us all not forget the most important factor is the team you play against btw. I'd be more than happy for Hawks to travel to Brisbane for all 22 games than to play at home against Sydney for 22 games.
Bit of a flawed example... I mean anyone would prefer to play brisbane 22 games a year over sydney for about any year in the past 10 years :P
It was a deliberate hyperbole to re-iterate that who you play is always considerably more important than where you play :P
depends the eagles only won 5 interstate games out of i think 10 so 50%. then won 11/12 in WA or 92%.
so realistically you should rather play anyone at home rather then eagles at Subi even though eagles are by no means the best team in the comp.
Stkilda won 0 interstate games and where shocking away.
they lost to GC in GC, port in port, murderded by the gws, crows eagles and sydney away im talking like 300+ combined losses.
but in melbourne beat the dogs, geelong, dee etc...
so yeah would love to play stkilda away from home if i was a non Victorian club.
where you play does matter
Quote from: Holz on December 19, 2016, 04:29:23 PM
eagles are by no means the best team in the comp.
Imma have to stop you right there
Quote from: Holz on December 19, 2016, 04:29:23 PM
Quote from: Scrads on December 19, 2016, 03:28:13 PM
Quote from: Ziplock on December 19, 2016, 01:51:12 PM
Quote from: Scrads on December 15, 2016, 11:24:18 PM
Let us all not forget the most important factor is the team you play against btw. I'd be more than happy for Hawks to travel to Brisbane for all 22 games than to play at home against Sydney for 22 games.
Bit of a flawed example... I mean anyone would prefer to play brisbane 22 games a year over sydney for about any year in the past 10 years :P
It was a deliberate hyperbole to re-iterate that who you play is always considerably more important than where you play :P
depends the eagles only won 5 interstate games out of i think 10 so 50%. then won 11/12 in WA or 92%.
so realistically you should rather play anyone at home rather then eagles at Subi even though eagles are by no means the best team in the comp.
Stkilda won 0 interstate games and where shocking away.
they lost to GC in GC, port in port, murderded by the gws, crows eagles and sydney away im talking like 300+ combined losses.
but in melbourne beat the dogs, geelong, dee etc...
so yeah would love to play stkilda away from home if i was a non Victorian club.
where you play does matter
We played GWS and Sydney at Etihad champ.
Quote from: Pkbaldy on December 20, 2016, 01:03:21 PM
Quote from: Holz on December 19, 2016, 04:29:23 PM
Quote from: Scrads on December 19, 2016, 03:28:13 PM
Quote from: Ziplock on December 19, 2016, 01:51:12 PM
Quote from: Scrads on December 15, 2016, 11:24:18 PM
Let us all not forget the most important factor is the team you play against btw. I'd be more than happy for Hawks to travel to Brisbane for all 22 games than to play at home against Sydney for 22 games.
Bit of a flawed example... I mean anyone would prefer to play brisbane 22 games a year over sydney for about any year in the past 10 years :P
It was a deliberate hyperbole to re-iterate that who you play is always considerably more important than where you play :P
depends the eagles only won 5 interstate games out of i think 10 so 50%. then won 11/12 in WA or 92%.
so realistically you should rather play anyone at home rather then eagles at Subi even though eagles are by no means the best team in the comp.
Stkilda won 0 interstate games and where shocking away.
they lost to GC in GC, port in port, murderded by the gws, crows eagles and sydney away im talking like 300+ combined losses.
but in melbourne beat the dogs, geelong, dee etc...
so yeah would love to play stkilda away from home if i was a non Victorian club.
where you play does matter
We played GWS and Sydney at Etihad champ.
yeah i just realised my fixture didnt put the home team first as i would expect.
regardless Stkilda struggled away.
GWS and Sydney you expect to lose to anywhere.
I look at it this way with premiership cups. If all teams can count their VFL-SANFL-WAFL etc cups, + AFL, I could invite 37 mates around for a bbq. If interstate teams can only count AFL premierships, I'm stuck with Grazz only ;)
So basically people are saying that the Dogs are the best because not only did we win the flag, we did it vs WC over there, vs Hawks on their home ground, vs GWS up there, vs Swans on a neutral ground (big difference between Docklands and MCG for us)? Glad we can all agree.
Quote from: meow meow on December 21, 2016, 01:26:03 PM
So basically people are saying that the Dogs are the best because not only did we win the flag, we did it vs WC over there, vs Hawks on their home ground, vs GWS up there, vs Swans on a neutral ground (big difference between Docklands and MCG for us)? Glad we can all agree.
Like, I can't speak for everyone, but that's what I've been picking up throughout this whole conversation
Quote from: meow meow on December 21, 2016, 01:26:03 PM
So basically people are saying that the Dogs are the best because not only did we win the flag, we did it vs WC over there, vs Hawks on their home ground, vs GWS up there, vs Swans on a neutral ground (big difference between Docklands and MCG for us)? Glad we can all agree.
Yes you where the best team in the finals by a mile. That we all agree on.
However overall one of the worst current team in AFL history with Stkilda/Fremantle.
North Aint much better but there is a clear bottom 3.
too early to put GC in but they will eventaully join the others if they keep doing nothing.
Needs more vinny!
Quote from: Holz on December 22, 2016, 11:51:07 AM
Quote from: meow meow on December 21, 2016, 01:26:03 PM
So basically people are saying that the Dogs are the best because not only did we win the flag, we did it vs WC over there, vs Hawks on their home ground, vs GWS up there, vs Swans on a neutral ground (big difference between Docklands and MCG for us)? Glad we can all agree.
Yes you where the best team in the finals by a mile. That we all agree on.
However overall one of the worst current team in AFL history with Stkilda/Fremantle.
North Aint much better but there is a clear bottom 3.
too early to put GC in but they will eventaully join the others if they keep doing nothing.
we're not actually that bad an AFL side. we've made the finals heaps of times, 4 grand finals, heaps of prelims... just not the ultimate success. Richmond for example are a much worse team since the AFL became a national competition
Quote from: Bill Manspeaker on December 22, 2016, 11:06:34 PM
Quote from: Holz on December 22, 2016, 11:51:07 AM
Quote from: meow meow on December 21, 2016, 01:26:03 PM
So basically people are saying that the Dogs are the best because not only did we win the flag, we did it vs WC over there, vs Hawks on their home ground, vs GWS up there, vs Swans on a neutral ground (big difference between Docklands and MCG for us)? Glad we can all agree.
Yes you where the best team in the finals by a mile. That we all agree on.
However overall one of the worst current team in AFL history with Stkilda/Fremantle.
North Aint much better but there is a clear bottom 3.
too early to put GC in but they will eventaully join the others if they keep doing nothing.
we're not actually that bad an AFL side. we've made the finals heaps of times, 4 grand finals, heaps of prelims... just not the ultimate success. Richmond for example are a much worse team since the AFL became a national competition
Since the AFL began (1990), Richmond and Fremantle are the worst. Found this little thing (Back from end of 2014 season). It's the average ladder finish between 1990-2014.
1.Geelong - 5.54
2.West Coast - 6.67
3.North Melbourne - 7.21
4.Collingwood - 7.58
5.Essendon - 7.63
6.Hawthorn - 7.63
7.Adelaide - 7.74
8.Sydney 7.88
9.Port Adelaide - 8.12
10.St Kilda - 8.46
11.Western Bulldogs - 8.46
12.Brisbane Lions - 8.53
13.Carlton - 8.75
14.Melbourne - 10.46
15.Fremantle - 10.63
16.Richmond - 11.13
17.Brisbane Bears - 11.29*18.Fitzroy - 13.29*19.Gold Coast - 16.00
20.Greater Western Sydney - 18.00
Which is actually surprises me that the Lions are that far down... And no doubt be worse now after the last 2 seasons.
Quote from: Pkbaldy on December 23, 2016, 07:16:28 AM
Quote from: Bill Manspeaker on December 22, 2016, 11:06:34 PM
Quote from: Holz on December 22, 2016, 11:51:07 AM
Quote from: meow meow on December 21, 2016, 01:26:03 PM
So basically people are saying that the Dogs are the best because not only did we win the flag, we did it vs WC over there, vs Hawks on their home ground, vs GWS up there, vs Swans on a neutral ground (big difference between Docklands and MCG for us)? Glad we can all agree.
Yes you where the best team in the finals by a mile. That we all agree on.
However overall one of the worst current team in AFL history with Stkilda/Fremantle.
North Aint much better but there is a clear bottom 3.
too early to put GC in but they will eventaully join the others if they keep doing nothing.
we're not actually that bad an AFL side. we've made the finals heaps of times, 4 grand finals, heaps of prelims... just not the ultimate success. Richmond for example are a much worse team since the AFL became a national competition
Since the AFL began (1990), Richmond and Fremantle are the worst. Found this little thing (Back from end of 2014 season). It's the average ladder finish between 1990-2014.
1.Geelong - 5.54
2.West Coast - 6.67
3.North Melbourne - 7.21
4.Collingwood - 7.58
5.Essendon - 7.63
6.Hawthorn - 7.63
7.Adelaide - 7.74
8.Sydney 7.88
9.Port Adelaide - 8.12
10.St Kilda - 8.46
11.Western Bulldogs - 8.46
12.Brisbane Lions - 8.53
13.Carlton - 8.75
14.Melbourne - 10.46
15.Fremantle - 10.63
16.Richmond - 11.13
17.Brisbane Bears - 11.29*
18.Fitzroy - 13.29*
19.Gold Coast - 16.00
20.Greater Western Sydney - 18.00
Which is actually surprises me that the Lions are that far down... And no doubt be worse now after the last 2 seasons.
When i said north was one of the worst thats for vfl afl with cjampionships.
When it comes to rhe afl north a top 5 competetive team. The ladder backs it up.
We are great at making pre lims
Quote from: Holz on December 23, 2016, 09:53:27 AM
Quote from: Pkbaldy on December 23, 2016, 07:16:28 AM
Quote from: Bill Manspeaker on December 22, 2016, 11:06:34 PM
Quote from: Holz on December 22, 2016, 11:51:07 AM
Quote from: meow meow on December 21, 2016, 01:26:03 PM
So basically people are saying that the Dogs are the best because not only did we win the flag, we did it vs WC over there, vs Hawks on their home ground, vs GWS up there, vs Swans on a neutral ground (big difference between Docklands and MCG for us)? Glad we can all agree.
Yes you where the best team in the finals by a mile. That we all agree on.
However overall one of the worst current team in AFL history with Stkilda/Fremantle.
North Aint much better but there is a clear bottom 3.
too early to put GC in but they will eventaully join the others if they keep doing nothing.
we're not actually that bad an AFL side. we've made the finals heaps of times, 4 grand finals, heaps of prelims... just not the ultimate success. Richmond for example are a much worse team since the AFL became a national competition
Since the AFL began (1990), Richmond and Fremantle are the worst. Found this little thing (Back from end of 2014 season). It's the average ladder finish between 1990-2014.
1.Geelong - 5.54
2.West Coast - 6.67
3.North Melbourne - 7.21
4.Collingwood - 7.58
5.Essendon - 7.63
6.Hawthorn - 7.63
7.Adelaide - 7.74
8.Sydney 7.88
9.Port Adelaide - 8.12
10.St Kilda - 8.46
11.Western Bulldogs - 8.46
12.Brisbane Lions - 8.53
13.Carlton - 8.75
14.Melbourne - 10.46
15.Fremantle - 10.63
16.Richmond - 11.13
17.Brisbane Bears - 11.29*
18.Fitzroy - 13.29*
19.Gold Coast - 16.00
20.Greater Western Sydney - 18.00
Which is actually surprises me that the Lions are that far down... And no doubt be worse now after the last 2 seasons.
When i said north was one of the worst thats for vfl afl with cjampionships.
When it comes to rhe afl north a top 5 competetive team. The ladder backs it up.
We are great at making pre lims
yeah North in the 90s were a freak team. something like 7(?) prelims in a row with 3 grand finals (2 wins, 1 loss). my mate blames that loss on me because I told him they'll beat Adelaide easily (after the cows beat us the previous year) and straight away he said if they lose it's my fault
1.Geelong - 148
2.West Coast - 177
3.Hawthorn - 191
4.Sydney - 195
5.North Melbourne - 203
6.Adelaide - 200 (26)
7.Collingwood - 217
8.Port Adelaide - 162 (20)
9.Essendon - 223
10.Western Bulldogs - 230
11.St Kilda - 244
12.Carlton - 255
13.Brisbane Lions - 194 (20)
14.Fremantle - 223 (22)
15.Melbourne - 292
16.Richmond - 293
17.Brisbane Bears - 79 (7)
18.Fitzroy - 93 (7)
19.Greater Western Sydney - 67 (5)
20.Gold Coast - 91 (6)
There we go, from the 27 seasons the AFL has been in existence :) Those that played less have the number in brackets.
Quote from: Bill Manspeaker on December 23, 2016, 10:36:08 AM
Quote from: Holz on December 23, 2016, 09:53:27 AM
Quote from: Pkbaldy on December 23, 2016, 07:16:28 AM
Quote from: Bill Manspeaker on December 22, 2016, 11:06:34 PM
Quote from: Holz on December 22, 2016, 11:51:07 AM
Quote from: meow meow on December 21, 2016, 01:26:03 PM
So basically people are saying that the Dogs are the best because not only did we win the flag, we did it vs WC over there, vs Hawks on their home ground, vs GWS up there, vs Swans on a neutral ground (big difference between Docklands and MCG for us)? Glad we can all agree.
Yes you where the best team in the finals by a mile. That we all agree on.
However overall one of the worst current team in AFL history with Stkilda/Fremantle.
North Aint much better but there is a clear bottom 3.
too early to put GC in but they will eventaully join the others if they keep doing nothing.
we're not actually that bad an AFL side. we've made the finals heaps of times, 4 grand finals, heaps of prelims... just not the ultimate success. Richmond for example are a much worse team since the AFL became a national competition
Since the AFL began (1990), Richmond and Fremantle are the worst. Found this little thing (Back from end of 2014 season). It's the average ladder finish between 1990-2014.
1.Geelong - 5.54
2.West Coast - 6.67
3.North Melbourne - 7.21
4.Collingwood - 7.58
5.Essendon - 7.63
6.Hawthorn - 7.63
7.Adelaide - 7.74
8.Sydney 7.88
9.Port Adelaide - 8.12
10.St Kilda - 8.46
11.Western Bulldogs - 8.46
12.Brisbane Lions - 8.53
13.Carlton - 8.75
14.Melbourne - 10.46
15.Fremantle - 10.63
16.Richmond - 11.13
17.Brisbane Bears - 11.29*
18.Fitzroy - 13.29*
19.Gold Coast - 16.00
20.Greater Western Sydney - 18.00
Which is actually surprises me that the Lions are that far down... And no doubt be worse now after the last 2 seasons.
When i said north was one of the worst thats for vfl afl with cjampionships.
When it comes to rhe afl north a top 5 competetive team. The ladder backs it up.
We are great at making pre lims
yeah North in the 90s were a freak team. something like 7(?) prelims in a row with 3 grand finals (2 wins, 1 loss). my mate blames that loss on me because I told him they'll beat Adelaide easily (after the cows beat us the previous year) and straight away he said if they lose it's my fault
yeah i have them best team in the 90s even though there where a few others who won as many flags.
even in the 2000s they have been good
Prelims in
2000, 2007, 2014, 2015
so 25% of the time which is about average so with the fantastic 90s should be up there.
Shame you get nothing but a showerty draft pick for losing in a prelim.
Everyone likes to feel sorry for St Kilda and Bulldogs and support them as their second team.
Well, They are almost up there with perennial finalists Sydney and Adelaide ???
Quote from: PowerBug on December 23, 2016, 12:37:31 PM
1.Geelong - 148
2.West Coast - 177
3.Hawthorn - 191
4.Sydney - 195
5.North Melbourne - 203
6.Adelaide - 200 (26)
7.Collingwood - 217
8.Port Adelaide - 162 (20)
9.Essendon - 223
10.Western Bulldogs - 230
11.St Kilda - 244
12.Carlton - 255
13.Brisbane Lions - 194 (20)
14.Fremantle - 223 (22)
15.Melbourne - 292
16.Richmond - 293
17.Brisbane Bears - 79 (7)
18.Fitzroy - 93 (7)
19.Greater Western Sydney - 67 (5)
20.Gold Coast - 91 (6)
There we go, from the 27 seasons the AFL has been in existence :) Those that played less have the number in brackets.
I might have missed something, what are those numbers?
Quote from: elephants on December 23, 2016, 04:18:51 PM
Shame you get nothing but a showerty draft pick for losing in a prelim.
preach.
Something you don't really feel unless you play XVs though I guess :P
Look at what Pk posted above, I just multiplied it out. I have the summed up the ladder positions of every team from 1990 onwards. Divide it by 27 (unless stated otherwise) to give the average ladder position.
Quote from: elephants on December 23, 2016, 04:18:51 PM
Shame you get nothing but a showerty draft pick for losing in a prelim.
As a fan i get alot of enjoyment out of watching my team be one of the best teams all year and wathcing 3 grandfinals with 2 flags in my lifetime.
Something similar you have experienced.
Personally would rather my team be good for 4-5 years and never win then dominant 1-2year win it and then do nothing much.
Please one winning gf beats 10 prelim losses! Your obviously too young to remember the feeling!
In a 10 year period, I would take 9 spoons and a premiership over 10 finals series personally. But I'm kinda living that anyway :P
Quote from: Purple 77 on December 26, 2016, 08:11:52 PM
In a 10 year period, I would take 9 spoons and a premiership over 10 finals series personally. But I'm kinda living that anyway :P
Agree Purps, 2004 was great, but no finals since, or another Premiership = Premiership hands down
Quote from: JBs-Hawks on December 26, 2016, 09:45:25 AM
Please one winning gf beats 10 prelim losses! Your obviously too young to remember the feeling!
guess it depends on what type of person you are.
If your good all year then you can enjoy that all year. If your win the thing its just a extra week or two of enjoyment. I hate to watch my team get killed everyweek.
Your a hawks fan so have had alot of sucess. If you supported a club that has recently been down the bottom you might have another tune.
Have not been involved in the discussion much so here is my 2 cents worth.
You support your team through ups and downs in the long run things turn around,
Prior to Brisbane coming into the competition I supported North Melboune so seen some of the hidings of the 60's prior to their premierships of 1975 and 1977.
When Brisbane came into the competition had to endure some of the Bears hidings of the 80's and 90's and was even at Carrara to witness the highest losing margin of 164 in 1992 to Geelong. The struggling Bears merged with a similarly struggling Fitzroy in 1997 and won 3 flags from 2001 - 2003.
So basically I am saying most clubs will have ups and downs but it does turn around and you ride the ups and down as a supporter. Whilst some of the defeats are hard to take I am happy as a supporter if players put in effort. (Last year there were times when I think Lions did not even reach this standard). I hope to add to my 5 premierships won by my clubs over the next few years.
As for the topic we only play the one preseason game in Qld at Carrara so only one chance to observe the team.
Quote from: Ringo on December 27, 2016, 12:30:11 PM
Have not been involved in the discussion much so here is my 2 cents worth.
You support your team through ups and downs in the long run things turn around,
Prior to Brisbane coming into the competition I supported North Melboune so seen some of the hidings of the 60's prior to their premierships of 1975 and 1977.
When Brisbane came into the competition had to endure some of the Bears hidings of the 80's and 90's and was even at Carrara to witness the highest losing margin of 164 in 1992 to Geelong. The struggling Bears merged with a similarly struggling Fitzroy in 1997 and won 3 flags from 2001 - 2003.
So basically I am saying most clubs will have ups and downs but it does turn around and you ride the ups and down as a supporter. Whilst some of the defeats are hard to take I am happy as a supporter if players put in effort. (Last year there were times when I think Lions did not even reach this standard). I hope to add to my 5 premierships won by my clubs over the next few years.
As for the topic we only play the one preseason game in Qld at Carrara so only one chance to observe the team.
Going?
Quote from: nas on December 27, 2016, 07:10:28 PM
Quote from: Ringo on December 27, 2016, 12:30:11 PM
Have not been involved in the discussion much so here is my 2 cents worth.
You support your team through ups and downs in the long run things turn around,
Prior to Brisbane coming into the competition I supported North Melboune so seen some of the hidings of the 60's prior to their premierships of 1975 and 1977.
When Brisbane came into the competition had to endure some of the Bears hidings of the 80's and 90's and was even at Carrara to witness the highest losing margin of 164 in 1992 to Geelong. The struggling Bears merged with a similarly struggling Fitzroy in 1997 and won 3 flags from 2001 - 2003.
So basically I am saying most clubs will have ups and downs but it does turn around and you ride the ups and down as a supporter. Whilst some of the defeats are hard to take I am happy as a supporter if players put in effort. (Last year there were times when I think Lions did not even reach this standard). I hope to add to my 5 premierships won by my clubs over the next few years.
As for the topic we only play the one preseason game in Qld at Carrara so only one chance to observe the team.
Going?
My mistake game is at Kombumerri Park, Merrimac was originally advertised as Metricon. So have to reconsider.
Don't try and pull the wool over us Power supporters Ringo lol
Only joking mate, big day :)
This is a really interesting discussion, but it's almost impossible to define when and where records should be kept from due to the multiple changes over such a long period of time. Consider the following:
1897 - VFL formed as a breakaway from the older VFA (Collingwood,Carlton, Essendon, Fitzroy, Geelong, Melbourne, South Melbourne and St Kilda)
1908 - First Expansion (Richmond/University to make 10 in league)
1914 - First Club departure (University)
1925 - Second Expansion (Footscray,Hawthorn and North Melbourne/12 teams)
1982 - First Club Relocation and name change (South Melbourne to Sydney)
1987 - Third Expansion (West Coast and Brisbane/14 team league)
1990 - Name change to AFL
1991 - Fourth Expansion (Adelaide/15 teams)
1995 - Fifth Expansion (Fremantle/16 teams)
1997 - First Merger and Sixth Expansion (Fitzroy/Brisbane and Port Adelaide/16 teams
2011 - Seventh Expansion (Gold Coast/17 teams)
2012 - Eighth Expansion (Greater Western Sydney/18 teams)
I know this is all common knowledge but I think it shows how many changes have happened to the league in it's long history and various guises. Obviously it only charts the VFL/AFL timeline, with the VFA, SANFL, WAFL all also having major effects on its make-up. It also doesn't show the affect of The World Wars, the centralization of suburban grounds vs VFL Park/Docklands stadium, semi-professionalism, full professionalism, abolition of Under 19s/reserve sides, sponsorship, sports science etc etc.
What does it mean? Not much really to be fair. Technically, the AFL as it stands today can really only count back to 2012 as this was the first time it contained 18 teams. Personally, I think this would be a slap in the face to the efforts of many teams prior, but isn't any less fair than only counting since 1990 or 1987 and is probably more accurate.
The Port situation is an interesting one, as they are the only non-Victorian established team to gain entry into the AFL. The precedence with other established Victorian expansion teams is that they don't get to count their VFA flags, but obviously the counter to this is that the SANFL was a far stronger competition than the VFA and in turn was arguably closer in standard to the old VFL.
Sorry for subjecting you to the ramblings of a late 30-something Melbourne supporter, one that has been to two Grand Finals his team has been in, 2000 (vs Essendon, ouch!) and 1988 (vs Hawthorn, double ouch!!), was at VFL Park when Jimmy Stynes ran over the mark in the Prelim Final, almost saw his team become the dawks in the 1996 failed merger, and seen way more losing seasons than winning ones since buying my first membership in 1987. In the same time i've also got to marvel over Flowers sublime skills, Lyons class, Vineys toughness (both father and son, probably cant count Jay), Stynes journey, Jackovich/Farmer/Jurrah's mercurial talent, the aerial exploits of Steve Smith, and just allround class of guys like Neitz, Schwartz, Green and Nat Jones. I'm also pretty excited about the potential of guys like Hogan, Petracca, Oliver, Weideman amongst others, hopefully we may be able to compete with the Juggernaut that will be/is GWS, and possibly get that ultimate success.
My point? Not much of one but in my humble opinion you need to embrace ALL your clubs history, no matter how long/short, good or bad. If you embrace it, then it shouldn't matter what other fans think, and makes it irrelevant as to whether it began 5/25/85 or 120 years ago.
For those that are cricket followers, would you rather be a Thunder or a Stars supporter? Thunder bottom of the BBL like every single season, except last season where they won the comp. Stars have made the top 4 every season but haven't won it before. Surely you'd all pick Thunder?
I'm definitely on the "be shower forever but happen to win one" side of the argument.
Quote from: PowerBug on January 02, 2017, 08:44:06 PM
For those that are cricket followers, would you rather be a Thunder or a Stars supporter? Thunder bottom of the BBL like every single season, except last season where they won the comp. Stars have made the top 4 every season but haven't won it before. Surely you'd all pick Thunder?
I'm definitely on the "be shower forever but happen to win one" side of the argument.
that's a bit different cos there's only been like 5 seasons. I'd happily finish dead last every year but then win the grand final on the 5th year
10 years is a long ass time. if you're shower (say bottom 2-4 every year, like 5 spoons) for 9 or more years, that's gonna feel like forever. you're gonna hate watching/going to the footy every year and that'll probably weigh you down so much you won't really care about footy any more. I don't know what it's like to see my team win a grand final so it's hard for me to say
if it was offered that way I'd probably take the flag and be shower for 10 years cos I just want that feeling. but it might be a different answer if I had already seen my team win a few flags
Quote from: Bill Manspeaker on January 02, 2017, 09:14:09 PM
Quote from: PowerBug on January 02, 2017, 08:44:06 PM
For those that are cricket followers, would you rather be a Thunder or a Stars supporter? Thunder bottom of the BBL like every single season, except last season where they won the comp. Stars have made the top 4 every season but haven't won it before. Surely you'd all pick Thunder?
I'm definitely on the "be shower forever but happen to win one" side of the argument.
that's a bit different cos there's only been like 5 seasons. I'd happily finish dead last every year but then win the grand final on the 5th year
10 years is a long ass time. if you're shower (say bottom 2-4 every year, like 5 spoons) for 9 or more years, that's gonna feel like forever. you're gonna hate watching/going to the footy every year and that'll probably weigh you down so much you won't really care about footy any more. I don't know what it's like to see my team win a grand final so it's hard for me to say
if it was offered that way I'd probably take the flag and be shower for 10 years cos I just want that feeling. but it might be a different answer if I had already seen my team win a few flags
Of course i wouldn't pick the thunder.
If my team is good all year and then loses right at the end ill have a down few weeks.
If my team sucks all year then im down all year.
If some people can watch their teams get pumped every week with just the "ohh we won a few years back" then good for them. But if i watch my team putting on a good show every single week with great plays, elite players then I dont even think about what happend a few years back as im enjoying the now.
As a coach in XV I would take being top 4 for 5 years straight and never winning over going old winning 1 cup then sucking for the next 4 years.
Yeah winning is great for bragging and saying your the best but end of the day it all comes down to luck and who was best on that day for winning flags. I think most people would agree the dogs wernt the best team this year they where the best team for a few weeks.
really there is no right or wrong answer each to their own. Im just happy if my team is competitive i just lose interest when i see my team getting pumped every week.